Many words don't have an exact equivalent in another language

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Many words don't have an exact equivalent in another language

Post by explorer »

Many words don't have an exact equivalent in another language. This is true if you pick any two languages, but some languages may have more equivalent words than others.

The examples I will discuss here will be with English and Khmer.

Take the English word 'orphan.' This is normally translated in Khmer as a word which sounds like 'gompria.' The English word orphan means a child where both parents have died. The Khmer word gompria can be used for a child where both parents have died. It can also be used where one parent has died, or where the parents have not died but separated. It can also be used where a child has been abandoned by the parents. There is no exact equivalent in Khmer for the English word orphan, and no exact equivalent in English for the Khmer word gompria. But it is translated as the word with the closest meaning.

Lets look at the English word 'car.' This is normally translated in Khmer as a word which sounds like 'laan.' The word laan can also mean truck or minivan. It is closer to the word vehicle. But car is translated as the word with the closest meaning.

The English word 'drown' is normally translated in Khmer as 'loong tduk.' Drown in English means 'death as a result of having difficulty in the water.' Loong tduk in Khmer means 'having difficulty in the water.' The person may live or die. There is no word with the exact same meaning, but it is translated as the word with the closest meaning.

The English words 'tall' and 'high' are both translated as a Khmer word which sounds like 'kpoo.' I sometimes tell people birds fly high, but birds are not tall. The Khmer word 'kpoo' can mean both tall and high.

There are many other English words without an exact equivalent in Khmer, and many other Khmer words without an exact equivalent in English. People who only learn from books often learn how words are translated, but not the true meaning.

For people learning English to be good at English, they need to spend time communicating with people who speak English well.

For people learning Khmer to be good at Khmer, they need to spend time communicating with Cambodian people.

It can take a long time to become good at a language.
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Re: Many words don't have an exact equivalent in another language

Post by Cinnamoncat »

explorer wrote: Thu Aug 08, 2019 1:21 am Many words don't have an exact equivalent in another language. This is true if you pick any two languages, but some languages may have more equivalent words than others.

The examples I will discuss here will be with English and Khmer.

Take the English word 'orphan.' This is normally translated in Khmer as a word which sounds like 'gompria.' The English word orphan means a child where both parents have died. The Khmer word gompria can be used for a child where both parents have died. It can also be used where one parent has died, or where the parents have not died but separated. It can also be used where a child has been abandoned by the parents. There is no exact equivalent in Khmer for the English word orphan, and no exact equivalent in English for the Khmer word gompria. But it is translated as the word with the closest meaning.

Lets look at the English word 'car.' This is normally translated in Khmer as a word which sounds like 'laan.' The word laan can also mean truck or minivan. It is closer to the word vehicle. But car is translated as the word with the closest meaning.

The English word 'drown' is normally translated in Khmer as 'loong tduk.' Drown in English means 'death as a result of having difficulty in the water.' Loong tduk in Khmer means 'having difficulty in the water.' The person may live or die. There is no word with the exact same meaning, but it is translated as the word with the closest meaning.

The English words 'tall' and 'high' are both translated as a Khmer word which sounds like 'kpoo.' I sometimes tell people birds fly high, but birds are not tall. The Khmer word 'kpoo' can mean both tall and high.

There are many other English words without an exact equivalent in Khmer, and many other Khmer words without an exact equivalent in English. People who only learn from books often learn how words are translated, but not the true meaning.

For people learning English to be good at English, they need to spend time communicating with people who speak English well.

For people learning Khmer to be good at Khmer, they need to spend time communicating with Cambodian people.

It can take a long time to become good at a language.
You may be preaching to the choir.
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Re: Many words don't have an exact equivalent in another language

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Cinnamoncat wrote: Thu Aug 08, 2019 2:22 am You may be preaching to the choir.
Not necessarily. There are new expats arriving all the time.
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Re: Many words don't have an exact equivalent in another language

Post by Ghostwriter »

Not necessarily. There are new expats arriving all the time.
...And from everywhere.

I don't know the etymology of "Okun / Thank you", but in Indonesian, "Thank you = Terima Kasih", which means 'Receive-give". i understand it like this, when said to me from someone who received something from me : " Expect to be repaid one day".

Not just a "tankiou / merci / thanks", because THAT sounds more like a "notification with moving on" attitude.

Let me get it right. I do not always expect to be repaid back. But i always expect that the person is aware and signifies the giver that she owes a favor back.

So the receiver should be mildly surprised in theory, when the giver is back after a while, looking for help / support / favor.

With people saying just "thanks", well, i don't know. After living around here, "thanks and pass"doesn't suffice anymore. Back to europe, i expect more a terima kasih"" situation when i do / receive something for / from someone.

Carry on, nice subject.

I guess it could deserves a parallel thread about language and behavior interactions, such as : How did learning another language affects your behavior ?" for example...
Last edited by Ghostwriter on Thu Aug 08, 2019 4:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Many words don't have an exact equivalent in another language

Post by Yerg »

Each language has it's own idiosynracies. I do find Khmer a particularly difficult language to navigate, and have lost count of the number of times I have used the right word (as I thought had learned) in the wrong way. What I do favour is the way when you try to speak Khmer, incorrectly, the locals will have a chuckle at you, not meant in an insulting way, but in a way that they love that you try to speak their language. And then they help you learn a little more.

I speak Arabic reasonably, but they don't help you learn when you err. They will be quite happy to either mock you or get offended at your incorrect use, despite there being numerous arabic dialects.

I find Khmer a beautiful language, and wish that I could speak it better than I do. It doesn't stop me learning though.
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Re: Many words don't have an exact equivalent in another language

Post by Yerg »

Ghostwriter wrote: Thu Aug 08, 2019 4:39 am
Not necessarily. There are new expats arriving all the time.
...And from everywhere.

I don't know the etymology of "Okun / Thank you", but in Indonesian, "Thank you = Terima Kasih", which means 'Receive-give". i understand it like this, when said to me from someone who received something from me : " Expect to be repaid one day".

Not just a "tankiou / merci / thanks", because THAT sounds more like a "notification with moving on" attitude.

Let me get it right. I do not always expect to be repaid back. But i always expect that the person is aware and signifies the giver that she owes a favor back.

So the receiver should be mildly surprised in theory, when the giver is back after a while, looking for help / support / favor.

With people saying just "thanks", well, i don't know. After living around here, "thanks and pass"doesn't suffice anymore. Back to europe, i expect more a terima kasih"" situation when i do / receive something for / from someone.

Carry on, nice subject.
And I do agree. Great subject, and I would love to hear other's opinions.
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Re: Many words don't have an exact equivalent in another language

Post by Ghostwriter »

and on the touchy side, when you read 1984, it's chilling because the point of it is the obliteration of words and therefore the concept, such as "freedom" for example.

So when there is a lack of "kind of important words for us", it reveals some very different conceptions of things.

Sorry to carry on on Indonesian (the only other "not far to be fluent" level i have with English), but we use Hear & Listen, and there is only Dengar as an equivalent. So noise or music, same word for the process of getting into your hears, provoke mixed emotions, get eargasm or bleeding from the tympanon, etc.

I can listen music for hours. My wife HAS to sing it.
And it ain't always pretty. And i have to endure it.



Image
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Re: Many words don't have an exact equivalent in another language

Post by Jamie_Lambo »

explorer wrote: Thu Aug 08, 2019 1:21 am Many words don't have an exact equivalent in another language. This is true if you pick any two languages, but some languages may have more equivalent words than others.

The examples I will discuss here will be with English and Khmer.

Take the English word 'orphan.' This is normally translated in Khmer as a word which sounds like 'gompria.' The English word orphan means a child where both parents have died. The Khmer word gompria can be used for a child where both parents have died. It can also be used where one parent has died, or where the parents have not died but separated. It can also be used where a child has been abandoned by the parents. There is no exact equivalent in Khmer for the English word orphan, and no exact equivalent in English for the Khmer word gompria. But it is translated as the word with the closest meaning.

Lets look at the English word 'car.' This is normally translated in Khmer as a word which sounds like 'laan.' The word laan can also mean truck or minivan. It is closer to the word vehicle. But car is translated as the word with the closest meaning.

The English word 'drown' is normally translated in Khmer as 'loong tduk.' Drown in English means 'death as a result of having difficulty in the water.' Loong tduk in Khmer means 'having difficulty in the water.' The person may live or die. There is no word with the exact same meaning, but it is translated as the word with the closest meaning.

The English words 'tall' and 'high' are both translated as a Khmer word which sounds like 'kpoo.' I sometimes tell people birds fly high, but birds are not tall. The Khmer word 'kpoo' can mean both tall and high.

There are many other English words without an exact equivalent in Khmer, and many other Khmer words without an exact equivalent in English. People who only learn from books often learn how words are translated, but not the true meaning.

For people learning English to be good at English, they need to spend time communicating with people who speak English well.

For people learning Khmer to be good at Khmer, they need to spend time communicating with Cambodian people.

It can take a long time to become good at a language.
you will find that if you take a single word it does have many meanings, it all depends on what other words the word is connected to in order for you to get a more accurate understanding, for example from your first word for orphan...

you can use the word កំព្រា Kompria to mean Orphan, you go on to say many other things it can mean, which it can, but there are actual words for them too, such as..
កូនកំព្រា/ក្មេងកំព្រា - Koun Kompria/Kmeng Kompria - an Orphan child
កំព្រាម្ដាយ - Kompria Mdaay - orphaned because the mother has died
កំព្រាឳពុក - Kompria Au Puk - orphaned because the father has died
មនុស្សកំព្រា - Mnus Kompria - someone with no living relatives
ត្រមោចកំព្រា - Tramaok Kompria - to be abandoned
កំព្រាចិត្ត - Kompria Jet - to feel lonely/alone

you are right though there are words in Khmer though that dont have direct translations in English or would require a sentence in English in order to 'describe' the meaning of the Khmer word, ill try and remember some when at work tomorrow
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Re: Many words don't have an exact equivalent in another language

Post by Ghostwriter »

Is Khmer a more comfortable language to talk about fight ? ( i mean fights like Mr Lambo does, physical). Do the vocabulary around fits it better in English or Khmer ?
In French we use many English words for it, so it seems from here that English is more efficient than French on this. A certain language is certainly more efficient than all the others on one subject, and this goes for all subjects. Maybe French for philosophy, maybe English for humor, and so on.
What is Khmer best for ?
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Re: Many words don't have an exact equivalent in another language

Post by explorer »

Ghostwriter wrote: Thu Aug 08, 2019 4:39 am I don't know the etymology of "Okun / Thank you"
thanks / thank you in Khmer is made up of two words.

'or' means 'glad.'

'kgoon' means 'good deed, or something good someone has done.'

So 'or kgoon' means, 'I am glad because of the good thing you did.'
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