Rutiger wrote:

juansweetpotato wrote:

Rutiger wrote:There is another thread where everyone is praising 15 year old Cambodian sex-trafficking victims for escaping forced confinement and running for help to police, which shows that some sex trafficking does take place (which we all pretty much knew already) and that some of those trafficked victims are in immediate need of outside assistance. Why continue to criticize NGOs, religious or otherwise, for attempting to do just that? If people voluntarily donate their own money to such a cause then that's their right. Why all the CEO bitching and moaning about that? Rightfully criticize and condemn these NGOs all you want if they force any "rescued" girls to do anything the girls don't want to do after the high-profile door kicking, or if they mistreat the girls in any way, or if they lie about their actions and results to gain donations, but I'm all in favor of some NGOs making attempts to free such people if there is any possibility that some are being held against their will. Those 15 years old girls who "saved themselves" might have appreciated their locked confines being kicked in a few weeks ago.

Because I'm almost 100% sure both the KT and the local Khmer papers didn't report that story correctly. I wish Felgergarb were here.

Regardless if the story was reported incorrectly, the thread comments by CEO posters were based on the OP as written. On that thread it's all "hooray, possibly sex-trafficked girls are heroes for saving themselves from captivity!". On this thread it's "Boooo, useless f*cking NGOs wasting time and donated money by attempting to save girls from possible sex trafficking!"

Yeah, I think that's just because it's in our better natures to want to help and we all love to hear a story that we can believe in and that doesn't include yet another example of where some, at best ignorant, Christian is doing the "saving".

We have learnt that often they are scammers. OR they may "save" them from something just to "save" them from something else, and then need saving again. Ever seen a film called Oranges aren't the Only Fruit? What people want are clean wise people to do the saving, not lying, scamming, money making sexual deviants like are all too often found in the church of prostitute redemption. OH LOOOORRRRRRD!

Did anyone notice that Mr and Mrs Pork Redemption's stated best rescue so far was a Ugandan woman? Presumably because she was already a devote Christian, so they had some success in their eyes. Not good enough to save them, so that they can still be Muslims or something else that's heathen and unholy. They say she is back in Uganda, has married a husband, opened her own business and goes to Church a lot.

Unfortunately, the press is also into making cash and often supporting the status quo, so don't believe everything you read in the papers, even if you want to believe it. A recent thread on K440 comes to mind. Not that that case has wholely vindicated APLE, the police or the embassy. Even though it looked like it at the time.

As I stated before, these organizations have zero effect on Asian child prostitution. Zilch. It's the government, police and military who run it all. Who do you think runs the chicken farm ffs!

Rutiger wrote:There is another thread where everyone is praising 15 year old Cambodian sex-trafficking victims for escaping forced confinement and running for help to police, which shows that some sex trafficking does take place (which we all pretty much knew already) and that some of those trafficked victims are in immediate need of outside assistance. Why continue to criticize NGOs, religious or otherwise, for attempting to do just that? If people voluntarily donate their own money to such a cause then that's their right. Why all the CEO bitching and moaning about that? Rightfully criticize and condemn these NGOs all you want if they force any "rescued" girls to do anything the girls don't want to do after the high-profile door kicking, or if they mistreat the girls in any way, or if they lie about their actions and results to gain donations[ but I'm all in favor of some NGOs making attempts to free such people if there is any possibility that some are being held against their will. Those 15 years old girls who "saved themselves" might have appreciated their locked confines being kicked in a few weeks ago.

Becuz.... for a start...

We're sending seven upper-middle class suburbanites half way across the world to do like four days of work with a ministry focused on the prevention, rescue, and restoration of victims of sex-trafficking. And, oh, it's going to cost around $30,000...

Well-meaning people are giving money to organisations which spend it on flying other equally well-meaning people half-way around the world in order to market their organisation for the purpose of raising more money. You may think that's fair enough; I don't.
I know that this is how a lot of charities work, but that doesn't mean that it's an efficient way to help people.

But brutality has its own drawbacks as a business model, particularly during a crackdown, pimps say. Brothels that imprison and torture girls have to pay for 24-hour guards, and they lose business because they can’t allow customers to take girls out to hotel rooms. Moreover, the Cambodian government has begun prosecuting the most abusive traffickers.

Does that mean they have started prosecuting themselves?

“One brothel owner here was actually arrested,” complained another owner in Poipet, indignantly. “After that, I was so scared, I closed the brothel for a while.”

"I'm good to my girls", said Srey Moma San. "I only occasionally cut and burn them because I'm pissed off at the women from the market over-charging me because they know I have money."

Rutiger wrote:

juansweetpotato wrote:

Rutiger wrote:There is another thread where everyone is praising 15 year old Cambodian sex-trafficking victims for escaping forced confinement and running for help to police, which shows that some sex trafficking does take place (which we all pretty much knew already) and that some of those trafficked victims are in immediate need of outside assistance. Why continue to criticize NGOs, religious or otherwise, for attempting to do just that? If people voluntarily donate their own money to such a cause then that's their right. Why all the CEO bitching and moaning about that? Rightfully criticize and condemn these NGOs all you want if they force any "rescued" girls to do anything the girls don't want to do after the high-profile door kicking, or if they mistreat the girls in any way, or if they lie about their actions and results to gain donations, but I'm all in favor of some NGOs making attempts to free such people if there is any possibility that some are being held against their will. Those 15 years old girls who "saved themselves" might have appreciated their locked confines being kicked in a few weeks ago.

Because I'm almost 100% sure both the KT and the local Khmer papers didn't report that story correctly. I wish Felgergarb were here.

Regardless if the story was reported incorrectly, the thread comments by CEO posters were based on the OP as written. On that thread it's all "hooray, possibly sex-trafficked girls are heroes for saving themselves from captivity!". On this thread it's "Boooo, useless f*cking NGOs wasting time and donated money by attempting to save girls from possible sex trafficking!"

That's the difference. The girls saved themselves from a real situation, the NGOs bend the truth to make themselves look as good as possible with as little actual effort as possible. Possible sex trafficking encompasses every bar girl according to these out of touch proselytizers.

ot mien kampf wrote: The girls saved themselves from a real situation, the NGOs bend the truth to make themselves look as good as possible with as little actual effort as possible. Possible sex trafficking encompasses every bar girl according to these out of touch proselytizers.

Maybe, but it doesn't mean all their efforts are ineffective. You have no idea how many rescues by such NGOs are actual rescues from sex traffickers and how many are bullshit stories. Had some Mormon missionary NGO physically saved those 15 years old girls (from the other thread in question) from their confinement, the CEO anti-NGO brigade would be calling "BULLSHIT! THE LYING, PROSELYTIZING NGO WANKERS MADE THAT RESCUE STORY UP TO LOOK GOOD AND GET MORE DONATIONS!"

Thank goodness those girls saved themselves. Most young girls caught in that awful, dangerous situation can't save themselves and put their lives in serious jeopardy to even try to escape it.

Rutiger wrote:

ot mien kampf wrote: The girls saved themselves from a real situation, the NGOs bend the truth to make themselves look as good as possible with as little actual effort as possible. Possible sex trafficking encompasses every bar girl according to these out of touch proselytizers.

You don't know that at all. You have no idea how many rescues by such NGOs are actual rescues from sex traffickers and how many are bullshit stories. Had some Mormon missionary NGO physically saved those 15 years old girls (from the other thread in question) from their confinement, the CEO anti-NGO brigade would be calling "BULLSHIT! THE LYING, PROSELYTIZING NGO WANKERS MADE THAT RESCUE STORY UP TO LOOK GOOD AND GET MORE DONATIONS!"

Thank goodness those girls saved themselves. Most young girls caught in that awful, dangerous situation can't save themselves and put their lives in serious jeopardy to even try to escape it.

Exactly. I don't know because there's no oversight. They're like the police, they get to do what they like, be as corrupt as they desire and boss around who they want until there's some truly monumental outside pressure (as happened with Somaly Mam and SISHA) and then they still complain because their narrative is supposedly "noble" and you must be a "bad person" for questioning it. The non-orphan orphanage industry in Cambodia still can't be touched because these cunts want their self righteous feel good endeavors to continue and satisfy a false sense of superiority. Savior spin is nothing but marketing department drivel.

Fuck them to hell and back. They have to prove they deserve my respect and that they are telling the truth.

ot mien kampf wrote: they still complain because their narrative is supposedly "noble" and you must be a "bad person" for questioning it. The non-orphan orphanage industry in Cambodia still can't be touched because these cunts want their self righteous feel good endeavors to continue and satisfy a false sense of superiority. Savior spin is nothing but marketing department drivel.

Fuck them to hell and back. They have to prove they deserve my respect and that they are telling the truth.

You can question their methods and be skeptical all you want. No one is suggesting otherwise. But in blanketing all anti-sex trafficking NGOs as lying thieves , we may be doing actual harm to genuine trafficking victims as well. What percentage of NGO rescues have to meet your idea of "genuine" in order to say it is a worthy organization? I say let the donors decide if their money is being well spent. If it was your tax money being spent, then I'd say you're spot on.

I don't agree with lumping this issue in with the orphanages problem, which may genuinely introduce some helpless children to harm that they wouldn't otherwise be subjected to.

ot mien kampf wrote:

Rutiger wrote:

ot mien kampf wrote: The girls saved themselves from a real situation, the NGOs bend the truth to make themselves look as good as possible with as little actual effort as possible. Possible sex trafficking encompasses every bar girl according to these out of touch proselytizers.

You don't know that at all. You have no idea how many rescues by such NGOs are actual rescues from sex traffickers and how many are bullshit stories. Had some Mormon missionary NGO physically saved those 15 years old girls (from the other thread in question) from their confinement, the CEO anti-NGO brigade would be calling "BULLSHIT! THE LYING, PROSELYTIZING NGO WANKERS MADE THAT RESCUE STORY UP TO LOOK GOOD AND GET MORE DONATIONS!"

Thank goodness those girls saved themselves. Most young girls caught in that awful, dangerous situation can't save themselves and put their lives in serious jeopardy to even try to escape it.

Exactly. I don't know because there's no oversight. They're like the police, they get to do what they like, be as corrupt as they desire and boss around who they want until there's some truly monumental outside pressure (as happened with Somaly Mam and SISHA) and then they still complain because their narrative is supposedly "noble" and you must be a "bad person" for questioning it. The non-orphan orphanage industry in Cambodia still can't be touched because these cunts want their self righteous feel good endeavors to continue and satisfy a false sense of superiority. Savior spin is nothing but marketing department drivel.

Fuck them to hell and back. They have to prove they deserve my respect and that they are telling the truth.

Spot on Sir

Rutiger wrote:

ot mien kampf wrote: they still complain because their narrative is supposedly "noble" and you must be a "bad person" for questioning it. The non-orphan orphanage industry in Cambodia still can't be touched because these cunts want their self righteous feel good endeavors to continue and satisfy a false sense of superiority. Savior spin is nothing but marketing department drivel.

Fuck them to hell and back. They have to prove they deserve my respect and that they are telling the truth.

You can question their methods and be skeptical all you want. No one is suggesting otherwise. But in blanketing all anti-sex trafficking NGOs as lying thieves , we may be doing actual harm to genuine trafficking victims as well. What percentage of NGO rescues have to meet your idea of "genuine" in order to say it is a worthy organization? I say let the donors decide if their money is being well spent. If it was your tax money being spent, then I'd say you're spot on.

I don't agree with lumping this issue in with the orphanages problem, which may genuinely introduce some helpless children to harm that they wouldn't otherwise be subjected to.

100%. No one should be making money out of prostitution of a child. Full stop. If you had been here in the early 00's you would have heard stories about NGO's that curdled your blood. Cambodia is the place where people like LTO (who I met back then) first enlightened me to the NGO scams here which gave me an interest enough to find out that it's a global model. When Cambodia got safer in the late 00's, that's when the NGO hoards really started swarming. Up by 75%.

As I stated before, these organizations have pretty much zero effect on Asian child prostitution. It's the government, police and military who run it all.

EG Who do you think ran and still runs the chicken farm. Not that they have underage girls there anymore. Well, I don't believe so. Who knows what the locals get up to.

juansweetpotato wrote:

Rutiger wrote: What percentage of NGO rescues have to meet your idea of "genuine" in order to say it is a worthy organization?

100%.

So you are saying if an NGO conducted thousands of suspected brothel raids and only 50% of them resulted in actual human trafficking victims being freed from captivity, you would dismiss that NGO as a corrupt failure, regardless if that 50% effectiveness meant hundreds of girls were genuinely rescued? That's just plain nonsense.