A shower thought that I don't think many expats give much consideration

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xandreu
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A shower thought that I don't think many expats give much consideration

Post by xandreu »

I was feeling a bit lazy this week and decided to take my washing to a launderette instead of doing it myself. There's one close by which I've never used before so I thought I'd take it there. I handed my bag over to the girl and she smiled and said 'something something Khmer?', clearly asking if I spoke Khmer. I did my usual 'hang my head in shame' embarrassed look and shook my head.

"Ok," she laughed. "I not see you before?"
"No", I said. "I've never been here before. I normally wash it myself but I'm being lazy haha".
"If I wash good for you then maybe you come back again?"
"Of course" I replied.

Then she said that classic line -
"I'm sorry for my English. My English not good".

I politely assured her that her English was very good, joking that her English was much better than my Khmer.

This is something I've thought about before many times. Can you imagine a situation where you would ever hear a westerner in an English speaking country actually apologising to a foreigner because he/she doesn't speak the language of the foreigner?

It would never, ever happen in my country of the UK. Ever. People may not say it openly, but there is a deeply ingrained attitude that if a non-British person (let's be honest, being non-white doesn't help either) is in the UK and is clearly not a tourist, it is not only expected, but kind of demanded that you speak English, and if you don't, well, that's your problem. "Oh, you expect ME to learn YOUR language, even though we're in MY country and we speak ENGLISH here?' is generally the prevailing attitude when it comes to these issues in the UK, even if it's not said out loud.

Whereas in Cambodia, this is the exact opposite. When we go into Khmer stores, or have to communicate with Khmers for whatever reason, it is automatically assumed that we probably don't speak Khmer. In that situation, one of two things happen. Either the person we're trying to communicate with will speak English, or at least attempt to speak English if their English is poor, (whilst apologising for not speaking your language very well) or there will usually be someone around who does speak English and they will go and get them to help.

In all of my years of living here, I have never ever felt that any Khmer has taken the attitude of "Oh, you expect ME to speak English, even though we're in Cambodia, you clearly live here, and we speak Khmer here??!!" as you would find in the west.

Not only do we often take it for granted how easy it is to live here without having to learn Khmer, but I don't think we give enough consideration to just how different attitudes are between the cultures when it comes to this sort of thing. In the west, if someone doesn't speak English, the general attitude is "Not my problem". Here, if someone doesn't speak Khmer, the general attitude is "What can I do to help?"

- Incidentally, I have been taking regular Khmer lessons for the past couple of months. I know I've left it very late but better late than never, so please don't lingo-shame me.
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Re: A shower thought that I don't think many expats give much consideration

Post by Kenr »

Good post. Since I've been here I've had the unfortunate pleasure of witnessing how some westerners here aren't as tolerable as Khmer's when it comes to the language barrier.
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Freightdog
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Re: A shower thought that I don't think many expats give much consideration

Post by Freightdog »

Incidentally, I have been taking regular Khmer lessons for the past couple of months.
Slight drift, but I’d be curious to have regular lessons when I’m in town. My inconsistent presence has a knock on effect on my language skills.
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John Bingham
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Re: A shower thought that I don't think many expats give much consideration

Post by John Bingham »

In all of my years of living here, I have never ever felt that any Khmer has taken the attitude of "Oh, you expect ME to speak English, even though we're in Cambodia, you clearly live here, and we speak Khmer here??!!" as you would find in the west.
I have often encountered this. Most locals, especially if you deal with officials, are quite surprised if you have lived here a reasonable amount of time and don't have a basic understanding of the Khmer language.
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HaifongWangchuck
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Re: A shower thought that I don't think many expats give much consideration

Post by HaifongWangchuck »

In my opinion (and I say this as someone who speaks and reads Khmer moderately well), the real reason why Khmer is so rarely acquired by Barang is that the relationship most tourists have with Cambodia is far more transactional than other countries due to the nature of tourism here: for example, the Royal Government doesn't really encourage (nor to their credit, discourage) encounters with locals the way many countries do (Ireland's entire tourist campaign is built on it, for example), they are perfectly satisfied with shuttling Chinese tourists from Point A to Angkor Wat, where they will interact only with Khmer who already are fluent in Chinese and only make transactional encounters with locals to purchase things or be led on tours.

Meanwhile, most average middle-class Khmer have very little daily opportunities for genuine interaction, as the points of intersection are different: As Barang will generally shop at elite hypermarkets and upscale cafés, don't really attend Buddhist festivals etc. they will mostly be limited to interacting with both lower and upper class Khmer, who usually speak English well enough to make learning Khmer superfluous. As a result, many have no pressing need to learn, and thus many never really attempt it, especially considering how different Mon-Khmer is from most languages of the world, practically a language isolate in its own way.

Tl;Dr: the vast majority of middle class Khmer ( (the ones least likely to speak English) have very little chance for meaningful interaction with barang in their lives, while the lower class Khmer (i.e, service industry workers, tuktuk drivers, vendors) and upper class Khmer are the ones Barang are most likely to encounter, and they prefer to practice/demonstrate their English skills anyway.
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Alex
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Re: A shower thought that I don't think many expats give much consideration

Post by Alex »

I'd guess it depends on the area. If it's a touristy area and they can reasonably assume that you're a tourist, it's unlikely that anyone would expect you to speak Khmer. And in fact you often get praise for even the tiniest shred of Khmer you can manage to speak. Or understand. I understand numbers and Khmers often seem baffled that I can understand amounts they tell me in Khmer.

If you're seen as a longterm expat, on the other hand, I'd say the general expectation is that you can speak the local language. Anywhere.
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BklynBoy
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Re: A shower thought that I don't think many expats give much consideration

Post by BklynBoy »

piggybacking on @HaifongWangchuck said. Where i stay is near street 21 abdul carime. The landlord has a big house and a farm in another province-- doesnt speak any English but the neighbor's son who sells food to people ( the duck fetus thing) and other stuff.. His English is really good. He is in a university also. The landlord who owns property in PP and in other provinces speaks NO English.

Funny enough I was talking w/ the young guy and explained to him I am jewish assuming he wouldn't know what that even is. His answer was
"like albert Einstein" .. i was super shocked. I said yes, similar as him. He said he learned about it in School
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Kammekor
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Re: A shower thought that I don't think many expats give much consideration

Post by Kammekor »

I am pretty sure most expats living in Cambodia don't apply the same rules for themselves they will apply to immigrants in their home country.
As the OP wrote, Cambodian people are much more forgiving when it comes to a language gap than most Western countries.
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BklynBoy
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Re: A shower thought that I don't think many expats give much consideration

Post by BklynBoy »

Kammekor wrote: Sun Feb 18, 2024 8:38 pm I am pretty sure most expats living in Cambodia don't apply the same rules for themselves they will apply to immigrants in their home country.
As the OP wrote, Cambodian people are much more forgiving when it comes to a language gap than most Western countries.
I remember in college i was dating a Puerto Rican girl. Her mom spoke no English. At first i was like-- how can she live in the U.S. and speak no English? i was kinda turned off or something.
Later I realized that it takes a lot to not speak the native language of the country you are in AND STILL navigate services and get things done. Of course different cultures can be in a bubble but after thinking on it, I was impressed.
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newkidontheblock
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Re: A shower thought that I don't think many expats give much consideration

Post by newkidontheblock »

BklynBoy wrote:
Kammekor wrote: Sun Feb 18, 2024 8:38 pm I am pretty sure most expats living in Cambodia don't apply the same rules for themselves they will apply to immigrants in their home country.
As the OP wrote, Cambodian people are much more forgiving when it comes to a language gap than most Western countries.
I remember in college i was dating a Puerto Rican girl. Her mom spoke no English. At first i was like-- how can she live in the U.S. and speak no English? i was kinda turned off or something.
Later I realized that it takes a lot to not speak the native language of the country you are in AND STILL navigate services and get things done. Of course different cultures can be in a bubble but after thinking on it, I was impressed.
For the US, that’s not surprising.

All major government services mandate accommodation in various languages, especially in Spanish. Taxes and voting, included. Medical services as well. If they live in their own little enclave, no reason to integrate and actually learn English since everything is mandated to be in their language.

Part of why the US is fracturing at an alarming rate.

My opinions, of course.
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