xandreu wrote: ↑Wed Nov 16, 2022 11:29 am Joe Biden now saying it's unlikely that the missile was fired from Russia. Which leaves a couple of explanations...

Either it was fired from Russia but by saying that it wasn't, it avoids NATO having to generate some sort of response which will inevitably escalate the war to extremely dangerous levels.

Or, the missile was fired by the Ukrainians in the hope that the rest of the world will blame Russia, which will bring NATO further into the conflict, inevitably benefitting Ukraine immensely. If it turns out that this is the case, where will that leave Ukraine? Will the world see it as a dirty tactic by Ukraine to essentially trick the west into getting more involved?

Or is there another agent at play?

Strange times indeed...

xandreu wrote: ↑Wed Nov 16, 2022 12:39 pm

Jerry Atrick wrote: ↑Wed Nov 16, 2022 12:32 pm They are Ukranian, many reliable sources say

However propaganda will have it's way and we will never know the truth

All that actually matters is that NATO keep their shit in check and the unfortunate farmer

But shit like this happens in every conflict on all sides

Is inevitable that there's collateral damage

There has been collateral damage since the beginning of the war. Most of it deliberate. The difference is that, until now, it was contained within Ukraine.

The fact it has now leaked over into NATO territory, the very territory Biden has said from the beginning that every inch will be defended, has the potential to change the game significantly.

All that actually matters is that NATO keep their shit in check

hdgh29 wrote: ↑Wed Nov 16, 2022 3:37 pm This incident illustrates that any news we get about this sad conflict is primarily driven by Western anti-Russian bias, and the only time we hear from a Russian spokeperson they are usually characterised as speaking on behalf of the evil, monstrous, proto-satanic Putin, cast as virtually a new Hitler with nasty intent towards our dear democracy and lifestyles. I am not saying this is anywhere near the truth or not, but its like listening to an Adele song about a break-up -we are only getting one side of the story. In this case Zelenski has been caught out in a direct lie (see his comments on this incident) and it makes me wonder, as Robert Plant sang in Stairway.

hdgh29 wrote: ↑Wed Nov 16, 2022 3:37 pm This incident illustrates that any news we get about this sad conflict is primarily driven by Western anti-Russian bias, and the only time we hear from a Russian spokeperson they are usually characterised as speaking on behalf of the evil, monstrous, proto-satanic Putin, cast as virtually a new Hitler with nasty intent towards our dear democracy and lifestyles. I am not saying this is anywhere near the truth or not, but its like listening to an Adele song about a break-up -we are only getting one side of the story. In this case Zelenski has been caught out in a direct lie (see his comments on this incident) and it makes me wonder, as Robert Plant sang in Stairway.