Electrocution from Unplugging Phone with Wet Hands and Feet

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Electrocution from Unplugging Phone with Wet Hands and Feet

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Cambodia News (Siem Reap Province): At 6:00 pm on August 7, 2022, at a construction site in Takasen Thboung village, Sangkat Kork Chork, Neb Pheaneth, a 23-year-old man was electrocuted to death while charging his phone with wet hands.

According to the witness, at around 5 o'clock in the evening, they were working at the construction site when it started raining. The victim then took his phone out to charge it at the power socket by the wall and went back to work inside. He returned barefoot moments later with wet hands to unplug the phone, but he was immediately electrocuted.
The victim's colleagues noticed and they immediately switched off the main power before they tried to resuscitate him while waiting for an ambulance.
Unfortunately, the man succumbed to his injuries when they arrived at the hospital. The police autopsy confirmed that he had died from electrocution.
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Re: Electrocution from Unplugging Phone with Wet Hands and Feet

Post by violet »

When I read about electrocutions like this I look back on the time i got a jolt from dodging wiring in Egypt when I turned on the light to my accommodation, and feel lucky. It wasn’t a tingle; definitely a jolt.

I read the above and think he must have been unplugging from the socket rather than the phone, surely? I have had tingles from a friend’s phone charger that had exposed wiring. Or does a lack of an earth mean even unplugging from the phone leads to death?
Despite what angsta states, it’s clear from reading through his posts that angsta supports the free FreePalestine movement.
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Re: Electrocution from Unplugging Phone with Wet Hands and Feet

Post by Freightdog »

violet wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 3:25 am I read the above and think he must have been unplugging from the socket rather than the phone, surely? I have had tingles from a friend’s phone charger that had exposed wiring. Or does a lack of an earth mean even unplugging from the phone leads to death?
The phone connection is reasonably low power (5-12watts low current, DC) If the charger is properly made, then it should be isolated. But the charger connection to the wall socket is still a problem. This is where the shite that people buy at the market is a problem. It looks for all intents and purposes genuine on the outside. Inside, it’s barely even a regulated supply. Certainly, the crappy ones that have accumulated at home that I’ve destroyed have been a liability on closer inspection. Abysmal assembly.

If you took a genuine charger and one of these knock offs, and weighed them, you’d see a difference. Yet they look identical. Some of them, if you shake them, you can hear the components rattling inside. That’s when they are new, at the market.
I had some photos of what looked like a genuine US style iPhone charger, which was not very old. It burned out internally, and then kept cooking. The house circuit breaker never even tripped as there was not enough current for an overload, and there is (was) NO earth/fault protection in any of the places that I’ve rented.

But there’s frequently clues that can distinguish them. Even the A/C pins are often badly plated, which leads to problems like bad connections. The sort where you keep jiggling the thing to make contact.

We’ve also got a multi-socket extension lead, which supposedly had its own protection. AC and USB outlets. It caught fire with just one usb cable connected. In an average home, there’d be a full on fire long before whatever poor electrical protection kicked in.
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Re: Electrocution from Unplugging Phone with Wet Hands and Feet

Post by Doc67 »

Freightdog wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 1:48 pm
violet wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 3:25 am I read the above and think he must have been unplugging from the socket rather than the phone, surely? I have had tingles from a friend’s phone charger that had exposed wiring. Or does a lack of an earth mean even unplugging from the phone leads to death?
The phone connection is reasonably low power (5-12watts low current, DC) If the charger is properly made, then it should be isolated. But the charger connection to the wall socket is still a problem. This is where the shite that people buy at the market is a problem. It looks for all intents and purposes genuine on the outside. Inside, it’s barely even a regulated supply. Certainly, the crappy ones that have accumulated at home that I’ve destroyed have been a liability on closer inspection. Abysmal assembly.

If you took a genuine charger and one of these knock offs, and weighed them, you’d see a difference. Yet they look identical. Some of them, if you shake them, you can hear the components rattling inside. That’s when they are new, at the market.
I had some photos of what looked like a genuine US style iPhone charger, which was not very old. It burned out internally, and then kept cooking. The house circuit breaker never even tripped as there was not enough current for an overload, and there is (was) NO earth/fault protection in any of the places that I’ve rented.

But there’s frequently clues that can distinguish them. Even the A/C pins are often badly plated, which leads to problems like bad connections. The sort where you keep jiggling the thing to make contact.

We’ve also got a multi-socket extension lead, which supposedly had its own protection. AC and USB outlets. It caught fire with just one usb cable connected. In an average home, there’d be a full on fire long before whatever poor electrical protection kicked in.
I just swapped my Cambodian adapter for one I bought in the UK in June (I forgot to take one). However they are both made in China, so I am still not too comfortable.

Can't you get the breakers in the fuse board swapped for RCD ones which will trip with very slight excess loads rather than wait for the full 16 or 32 amp load being exceeded?
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Re: Electrocution from Unplugging Phone with Wet Hands and Feet

Post by Tootsfriend »

Spoiler:
Doc67 wrote: Sun Aug 14, 2022 4:01 pm
Freightdog wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 1:48 pm
violet wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 3:25 am I read the above and think he must have been unplugging from the socket rather than the phone, surely? I have had tingles from a friend’s phone charger that had exposed wiring. Or does a lack of an earth mean even unplugging from the phone leads to death?
The phone connection is reasonably low power (5-12watts low current, DC) If the charger is properly made, then it should be isolated. But the charger connection to the wall socket is still a problem. This is where the shite that people buy at the market is a problem. It looks for all intents and purposes genuine on the outside. Inside, it’s barely even a regulated supply. Certainly, the crappy ones that have accumulated at home that I’ve destroyed have been a liability on closer inspection. Abysmal assembly.

If you took a genuine charger and one of these knock offs, and weighed them, you’d see a difference. Yet they look identical. Some of them, if you shake them, you can hear the components rattling inside. That’s when they are new, at the market.
I had some photos of what looked like a genuine US style iPhone charger, which was not very old. It burned out internally, and then kept cooking. The house circuit breaker never even tripped as there was not enough current for an overload, and there is (was) NO earth/fault protection in any of the places that I’ve rented.

But there’s frequently clues that can distinguish them. Even the A/C pins are often badly plated, which leads to problems like bad connections. The sort where you keep jiggling the thing to make contact.

We’ve also got a multi-socket extension lead, which supposedly had its own protection. AC and USB outlets. It caught fire with just one usb cable connected. In an average home, there’d be a full on fire long before whatever poor electrical protection kicked in.
I just swapped my Cambodian adapter for one I bought in the UK in June (I forgot to take one). However they are both made in China, so I am still not too comfortable.

Can't you get the breakers in the fuse board swapped for RCD ones which will trip with very slight excess loads rather than wait for the full 16 or 32 amp load being exceeded?

I'm no sparkie but I think they only work if there's a Earth system in the wiring
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Re: Electrocution from Unplugging Phone with Wet Hands and Feet

Post by SlowJoe »

Tootsfriend wrote: Sun Aug 14, 2022 6:47 pm
Doc67 wrote: Sun Aug 14, 2022 4:01 pm
Can't you get the breakers in the fuse board swapped for RCD ones which will trip with very slight excess loads rather than wait for the full 16 or 32 amp load being exceeded?
I'm no sparkie but I think they only work if there's a Earth system in the wiring
Correct, and good luck finding a properly earthed building here. I've only been in two properly earthed places here, and one of them was my own house.
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Re: Electrocution from Unplugging Phone with Wet Hands and Feet

Post by atst »

Would be great if they had power sockets that have an on off switch instead of plugging into a live socket.
I get worried every time I plug or unplug anything over here.
I'm standing up, so I must be straight.
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Re: Electrocution from Unplugging Phone with Wet Hands and Feet

Post by Doc67 »

SlowJoe wrote: Sun Aug 14, 2022 8:21 pm
Tootsfriend wrote: Sun Aug 14, 2022 6:47 pm
Doc67 wrote: Sun Aug 14, 2022 4:01 pm
Can't you get the breakers in the fuse board swapped for RCD ones which will trip with very slight excess loads rather than wait for the full 16 or 32 amp load being exceeded?
I'm no sparkie but I think they only work if there's a Earth system in the wiring
Correct, and good luck finding a properly earthed building here. I've only been in two properly earthed places here, and one of them was my own house.
Don't you become the earth when you touch something live with wet hands and feet? Isn't this the whole problem; with no earth and a live appliance, when you touch it you become the earth and die.

@Freightdog was saying that appliance and plug-in extension can burn through before the level of the circuit breaker is reached, and that's what makes it so dangerous, you're going to cop the full load before anything trips. An RCD trips with a leakage of milliamps over milliseconds and might, might, just save your life?

I am not trying to be argumentative here, I don't know enough about the technicals here, but anything that can cut the power even a split second earlier must be better than soaking up 32 amps, and RCD's trip in milliseconds with a leakage of milliamps.
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Re: Electrocution from Unplugging Phone with Wet Hands and Feet

Post by Freightdog »

As you might expect, there are varying levels and complexities of protection.

The primary principal of an RCD is balance. Namely, Current balance. What goes in, must come out. So the live/input is effectively measured and compared with the neutral/return. If what’s coming out doesn’t equal what went in, there’s a leak, and it trips. The residual current. I don’t believe the basic RCD needs an earth line.
As Doc67 mentions, it’s milliamps (mA) over 20-40milliseconds, (mS), equivalent to 1 to 2 full cycles of an alternating current, although some are rated to trip within 100mS, 5 cycles.
Pretty fast, still. Enough to stop serious complications for the human heart.

The basic RCDs work like this. There are more complex ones which do measure the earth line itself, and use internal electronics to actively trip the breaker, as well as having the more basic protection of a simple compared measurement.

What is often not appreciated is that in ac circuits, while the neutral line is normally at the same potential as the earth line, they are not one and the same.
Having an actual earth circuit for protection is ideal, and the RCD is further protection.

In answer to Doc’s question, I believe you should be able to have a main breaker with an RCD function. Best would be one that breaks both live and neutral lines. 2poles. But I have never seen an RCD breaker installed in any domestic setup, and in only one hotel (might have been snooky way) did I see what may have been an RCD. It was broken, though, yet all circuits were working. Many house breaker panels have a 2 pole circuit breaker.
Find one, though.

Cambodia’s electricity supply is 220Vac. Maybe Buy one from abroad, and wire it in. It takes about 5 minutes if the existing installation isn’t FUBAR like my last apartment was, but make sure the incoming supply is turned off.
I’d hazard a guess that any of the Supposed RCD protected cables available in the markets aren’t, or at least don’t perform to any worthwhile standard.

Caveat, though.
I’m not an electrician, I’m just (was) a humble electronics engineer, so there’s gaps in my appreciation.
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Re: Electrocution from Unplugging Phone with Wet Hands and Feet

Post by Doc67 »

Freightdog wrote: Mon Aug 15, 2022 11:54 am As you might expect, there are varying levels and complexities of protection.

The primary principal of an RCD is balance. Namely, Current balance. What goes in, must come out. So the live/input is effectively measured and compared with the neutral/return. If what’s coming out doesn’t equal what went in, there’s a leak, and it trips. The residual current. I don’t believe the basic RCD needs an earth line.
As Doc67 mentions, it’s milliamps (mA) over 20-40milliseconds, (mS), equivalent to 1 to 2 full cycles of an alternating current, although some are rated to trip within 100mS, 5 cycles.
Pretty fast, still. Enough to stop serious complications for the human heart.

The basic RCDs work like this. There are more complex ones which do measure the earth line itself, and use internal electronics to actively trip the breaker, as well as having the more basic protection of a simple compared measurement.

What is often not appreciated is that in ac circuits, while the neutral line is normally at the same potential as the earth line, they are not one and the same.
Having an actual earth circuit for protection is ideal, and the RCD is further protection.

In answer to Doc’s question, I believe you should be able to have a main breaker with an RCD function. Best would be one that breaks both live and neutral lines. 2poles. But I have never seen an RCD breaker installed in any domestic setup, and in only one hotel (might have been snooky way) did I see what may have been an RCD. It was broken, though, yet all circuits were working. Many house breaker panels have a 2 pole circuit breaker.
Find one, though.

Cambodia’s electricity supply is 220Vac. Maybe Buy one from abroad, and wire it in. It takes about 5 minutes if the existing installation isn’t FUBAR like my last apartment was, but make sure the incoming supply is turned off.
I’d hazard a guess that any of the Supposed RCD protected cables available in the markets aren’t, or at least don’t perform to any worthwhile standard.

Caveat, though.
I’m not an electrician, I’m just (was) a humble electronics engineer, so there’s gaps in my appreciation.
I am thinking about getting a few of these to plug into the sockets, for the kettle, washing machine and the extension leads. I will get them from the UK. The trouble is nothing might work once they are plugged in as they might start tripping it all the time.

EDIT.

I just found this out, so will need them testing before they get here.

the problem is, the off button or test button on the rcd will use the earth to create a small imbalance between the L and N to test the internal circuits of the rcd.
if you have nothing connected to the earth terminal then this will not work.
the rcd should still work but you will be unable to test it.


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