HE taking Myanmar matters into his own hands

phuketrichard · Post by **phuketrichard** » Fri Jan 07, 2022 9:02 am

traveling on an auspicious day Jan 7th... “Victory Day.”

excerpts , the whole article is worth reading...

Even before Cambodian Prime Minister HE arrives in Naypyidaw on Friday for talks with Myanmar’s junta, the first formal visit by a foreign leader since last year’s February 1 democracy-suspending coup, most observers of the situation have already made up their minds on the likely outcome and upshots.

For HE’s critics, the scheduled two-day talks with junta leader Min Aung Hlaing are merely an ego-boosting exercise for Cambodia’s long-ruling premier, who wants to get the Myanmar crisis off the top of the region’s agenda even if it means legitimizing a regime whose security forces have killed an estimated 1,400 civilians since February.

HE’s defenders, however, contend he has been dealt a bad hand after taking over as ASEAN’s rotational chair this year. The bloc’s policy on Myanmar clearly wasn’t working last year, they say, and the Myanmar crisis is getting worse with destabilizing spillover effects on the rest of the region. If the status quo isn’t working, it’s sensible to take a new approach, they say.

“The rushed trip is more reflective of HE’s do-it-myself attitude, consequences be damned, than a proactive response to ASEAN’s failure to bring about a diplomatic solution to the crisis,” said Hunter Marston, a researcher on Southeast Asia at the Australian National University.

“What’s wrong,” he added, “is the way HE has gone about the proposed visit: without conditions and with statements that overwhelmingly give the junta carte blanche to reset the terms of engagement with a friendly autocrat and – through him – with ASEAN.”

For starters, it’s difficult to know who exactly HE will be representing when in Naypyidaw: Cambodia or ASEAN. And, indeed, who Min Aung Hlaing thinks HE is representing.

There is speculation among observers and analysts that HE, perhaps out of some sort of authoritarian solidarity, is rushing off to Naypyidaw because he wants the junta to succeed – and, therefore, for the civil disobedience movement backed by a government-in-exile to fail.

“HE is authoritarian himself, just as Min Aung Hlaing, so I think that the meeting between the two in Naypyidaw will be productive in boosting joint policy efforts between two authoritarian regimes, as well as enhancing legitimacy for the Burmese junta,” said Paul Chambers, an academic at the center of ASEAN Community Studies at Naresuan University in Thailand.

There is also a perception that this visit has much to do with swelling HE’s ego, motivated in part by the hubris that he could replicate in Myanmar what he achieved in Cambodia in the 1990s when his government helped bring an end to a three-decade civil war.

https://asiatimes.com/2022/01/hun-sen-t ... d7ff190aa4

how the Burmese feel about his visit;

ofparadise · Post by **ofparadise** » Fri Jan 07, 2022 2:18 pm

These Burmese protesters don't seem to like anyone. All 5 of them.

Perhaps they should stop writing signs that contradict themselves.

Nobody has really given a flying **** about Burma in the last 4 months. They seem only interested in getting readership clicks, vs actual intervention.

No matter what your views may be on HE, at least he's injecting himself in the narrative in a concrete manner.

phuketrichard · Post by **phuketrichard** » Sat Jan 08, 2022 9:54 am

what cease fire??? how can u have cease fire talks when only one part is represented?

UN Security Council hasn't voted on a single draft resolution has sent a signal to #Myanmar's junta that UNSC is not just ineffective, but that it is indifferent to atrocities they are committing

i hate diplomatic talk.

orichá · Post by **orichá** » Sat Jan 08, 2022 11:41 am

ofparadise wrote: ↑Fri Jan 07, 2022 2:18 pm These Burmese protesters don't seem to like anyone.

Nobody has really given a flying **** about Burma in the last 4 months. They seem only interested in getting readership clicks, vs actual intervention.

No matter what your views may be on HE, at least he's injecting himself in the narrative in a concrete manner.

What a pompous [Mod edit: no need for name calling] you are. About the only thing HE is actually doing here is comparing notes on how to suck Chinese dick for more free guns and amo... Why not ask the friends and family of all the many murdered innocent Burmese civilians how they feel?

Furthermore, it seems a grotesque slap in the face to the memory of all the innocent victims of genocide in Cambodia itself, that pm Muppet chose to visit Burma on the day commemorating its tragedy, considering the already mentioned recent massacre of Burmese innocents by general Min Aung Hlaing himself, a man who appears more worried over his Singapore bank accounts and his spoiled son's ability to grab more later on than the fate of his nation...

In this terrible situation, how can the PM "inject himself into the narrative in a positive manner"? Engage in dialogue with a bloodthirsty despot!? You think the PM has no choice to go there just because he is the current chairman of ASEAN? In fact, he could ask ASEAN to boot out Myanmar instead!

siliconlife · Post by **siliconlife** » Sat Jan 08, 2022 12:01 pm

In my opinion, the main goal here is to reinforce ASEAN's non-interference policy at the cost of it's mutual consensus policy, something that has been ostensibly broken anyway. Win-win indeed.

ofparadise · Post by **ofparadise** » Sat Jan 08, 2022 1:47 pm

Peace is not brokered by tossing blame at each side and asking for apologies or judgement.

It lies somewhere in the middle.

And the sometimes that means having whiskey with warlords and tea with monks.

If those "notes" lead to a peace aggreement, then great. I hope it works.

Peace is not about what is right or righteous. It's about reducing bloodshed, and rebuilding the economy.

orichá wrote: ↑Sat Jan 08, 2022 11:41 am
ofparadise wrote: ↑Fri Jan 07, 2022 2:18 pm These Burmese protesters don't seem to like anyone.

Nobody has really given a flying **** about Burma in the last 4 months. They seem only interested in getting readership clicks, vs actual intervention.

No matter what your views may be on HE, at least he's injecting himself in the narrative in a concrete manner.
What a pompous [Mod edit: no need for name calling] you are. About the only thing HE is actually doing here is comparing notes on how to suck Chinese dick for more free guns and amo... Why not ask the friends and family of all the many murdered innocent Burmese civilians how they feel?

Furthermore, it seems a grotesque slap in the face to the memory of all the innocent victims of genocide in Cambodia itself, that pm Muppet chose to visit Burma on the day commemorating its tragedy, considering the already mentioned recent massacre of Burmese innocents by general Min Aung Hlaing himself, a man who appears more worried over his Singapore bank accounts and his spoiled son's ability to grab more later on than the fate of his nation...

In this terrible situation, how can the PM "inject himself into the narrative in a positive manner"? Engage in dialogue with a bloodthirsty despot!? You think the PM has no choice to go there just because he is the current chairman of ASEAN? In fact, he could ask ASEAN to boot out Myanmar instead!

orichá · Post by **orichá** » Sun Jan 09, 2022 11:26 am

ofparadise wrote: ↑Sat Jan 08, 2022 1:47 pm Peace is not brokered by tossing blame at each side and asking for apologies or judgement.

It lies somewhere in the middle.

And the sometimes that means having whiskey with warlords and tea with monks.

If those "notes" lead to a peace aggreement, then great. I hope it works.

Peace is not about what is right or righteous. It's about reducing bloodshed, and rebuilding the economy.

orichá wrote: ↑Sat Jan 08, 2022 11:41 am
ofparadise wrote: ↑Fri Jan 07, 2022 2:18 pm These Burmese protesters don't seem to like anyone.

Nobody has really given a flying **** about Burma in the last 4 months. They seem only interested in getting readership clicks, vs actual intervention.

No matter what your views may be on HE, at least he's injecting himself in the narrative in a concrete manner.
In this terrible situation, how can the PM "inject himself into the narrative in a positive manner"? Engage in dialogue with a bloodthirsty despot!? You think the PM has no choice to go there just because he is the current chairman of ASEAN? In fact, he could ask ASEAN to boot out Myanmar instead!

Peace is not about what is right? So, it's okay if someone kills my sister if he offers me a job next week? .... I can't see how a chilly amnesia about the massacre in Myanmar can lead to "peace" or anything even remotely acceptable to the majority of ordinary citizens. The military is done, they are no longer a legitimate force in Burma. End of story.

Darkcel · Post by **Darkcel** » Sun Jan 09, 2022 2:18 pm

Of course he supports the junta, he did the exact same shit here.

He's either going to make the ASEAN alliance collapse or somehow become more authoritarian in it's meetings, can't wait.

phuketrichard · Post by **phuketrichard** » Sun Jan 09, 2022 3:44 pm

Darkcel wrote: ↑Sun Jan 09, 2022 2:18 pm Of course he supports the junta, he did the exact same shit here.

He's either going to make the ASEAN alliance collapse or somehow become more authoritarian in it's meetings, can't wait.

He might be a sorta dictator but nothing he has done comes close to what the junta is doing in Burma.
No bombings of village's, torching churches, buildings AND PEOPLE> murders of civilians including children, terrorism acts against the locals, indiscriminate arrests of locals and holding them without charges and on and on....

do agree that ASEAN stands a good chance of being torn to pieces with He in charge or else even more ineffective than it already is.

ofparadise · Post by **ofparadise** » Sun Jan 09, 2022 4:10 pm

orichá wrote: ↑Sun Jan 09, 2022 11:26 am Peace is not about what is right? So, it's okay if someone kills my sister if he offers me a job next week? … I can't see how a chilly amnesia about the massacre in Myanmar can lead to "peace" or anything even remotely acceptable to the majority of ordinary citizens. The military is done, they are no longer a legitimate force in Burma. End of story.

Yes. Negotiating for peace is not about what is right or morale or just.

It's about bringing 2 polar opposite groups, with vastly different views on "right" to sit down and hammer out a middle ground to ensure there is no more bloodshed.

There's a time for everything.

Your concerns are about the atrocities that have been committed. Yes, they are appalling, sickening and evil. Those are issues for tribunal courts and the judiciary of the next generation.

Right now, they need to find a way to rebuild the economy, allow banks to operate, regain trust in foreign investment, establish passports for citizens to travel out of the country, among others.

So, it's okay if someone kills my sister if he offers me a job next week?

No it's not okay by any means. But if there's a peaceful way to ensure that the rest of your family are not murdered as another statistic of the war, and taking up a job with them is the only way... then yes. That's the smarter option. You live to plan another day.

As evident by the past few years, the junta is not going to walk away and surrender because no country in the region is going to stake their own men's lives and money on a offensive there.

And the junta are not a disparate group of mercenaries. They are an organized military with 400,000 active army personnel, 20,000 strong air force with over 250 jets, 180+ navel assets. They have spent over $2billion on the defense budget for the past 8 years.

They control all the waterways, airspace, and ports and terminals.

'which is why the game of power is delicate balance between the individual ideals and reality of everyday living.

And HE is a great spokesman for this side. He's the only one in the ASEAN board that has walked both sides of the lines.

HE taking Myanmar matters into his own hands

HE taking Myanmar matters into his own hands

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