xandreu wrote: ↑Thu Sep 23, 2021 1:46 pm Ok I clearly got my 'cases' and 'deaths' mixed up, but we're still talking about millions of unnecessary deaths...

OP- I recall there was a point made somewhere that there have been way, way more deaths from covid in the US (680,000 and counting) compared to the Vietnam war (47,434), Iraq (4,424) , Afghanistan (1,833), 9/11 (2,977), Korea (33,686), WW2 (291,557) and WW1 (53,402) all combined.

That puts some perspective doesn't it? I think the gist of your OP post still holds.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_ ... ies_of_war

The problem with asking for answers (in my humble opinion) is that it's a complicated situation.

For a start, expecting an honest, non-biased investigation that everyone would accept as truth seems impossible to me, as does expecting the main players to co-operate honestly. Nobody wants to be responsible for this shitshow, there's the loss of face for a start which in China's case is a massive thing, then there's the possibility of being held accountable later.
Aside from that, whatever the investigation found you could almost guarantee the facebook experts and various politicians would dispute it, there would be all sorts of misinformation and half baked 'science' thrown around and we'd be back where we are now - nobody having any idea what the truth really is.

Then there's the question of degrees of responsibility. It seems like China and the US were co-operating in the Wuhan lab, who do you blame for the leak (assuming it was a leak)? the scientists who made a mistake or the people who contratracted the job out to them knowing leaks were very common in labs and this particular lab had a bad track record already.

If the lab thing was ever resolved where to from there? We could blame China for not closing down the country quick enough and allowing it to spread but how do you fairly do that when pretty much every country in the world was hell bent on staying open as well - some governments refused to take any meaningful action which ensured the virus got a foothold everywhere and put us where we are now.

It seems to me everyone has some degree of fault here, every major world power has contributed to it being a global pandemic. I wish we could put aside politics and work together to overcome it but I can't see that happening either. I'd like to think we could collectively agree to not fuck around with dangerous stuff in labs anymore but that's probably never going to happen either.

clutchcargo wrote: ↑Thu Sep 23, 2021 2:13 pm

xandreu wrote: ↑Thu Sep 23, 2021 1:46 pm Ok I clearly got my 'cases' and 'deaths' mixed up, but we're still talking about millions of unnecessary deaths...

OP- I recall there was a point made somewhere that there have been way, way more deaths from covid in the US (680,000 and counting) compared to the Vietnam war (47,434), Iraq (4,424) , Afghanistan (1,833), 9/11 (2,977), Korea (33,686), WW2 (291,557) and WW1 (53,402) all combined.

That puts some perspective doesn't it? I think the gist of your OP post still holds.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_ ... ies_of_war

Yes, it was this fact that I was thinking about when I wrote it but I obviously got it a bit wrong. Thanks. And yes, it doesn't take anything anyway from my main point.

mention the holocaust

ali baba wrote: ↑Thu Sep 23, 2021 2:10 pm Covid is a force of nature so there's no one to blame.
Deaths were spread out over 18+ months.
Even if patient zero contracted it in a lab it wouldn't change anything anyway.

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Force of nature? I don't think so.

Humans, more specifically the CCP leadership of China knew for 2 and a half weeks that the virus was being transmitted from human to human and they lied about it and applied all available political pressure to keep international travel from China open. Why? To ensure the pain was shared.

They are the enemy of all freedom loving people. And they are responsible for the pandemic. Somehow African strongmen are able to alert the world when there is an ebola outbreak and shut things down, but the CCP made a political calculation that it was better for the virus to spread to everyone than for them to suffer alone.

The Wuhan lab produced it and the CCP ensured all humanity would suffer.

https://www.newsweek.com/wuhan-lab-want ... ow-1631784