Do you agree with mandatory vaccinations
- General Mackevili
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Re: Do you agree with mandatory vaccinations
I just have to point out that even the CDC's definition of 'VACCINATION' has recently changed...JBTrain wrote: ↑Sun Sep 19, 2021 5:53 pm You are correct, you don't apparently know what vaccination is for (seriously reducing risk of hospitalization and risk you'll transmit to others). Maybe read up on that for a start before throwing around the fascist card.
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I think it's fair to say that if you asked people 2 years ago, 'what is a vaccine?' most people would say it prevents you from catching something/makes you immune to something, but now they've changed the definition of vaccine to more closely match the characteristics of the amazing COVID-19 vaccine.
The CDC used to say a vaccine would give you 'immunity,' now vaccines are just supposed to give you 'protection.'
I've already shown how they've recently changed the definition for 'herd immunity,' and now they've changed the definition for a vaccine. (It's also interesting how we used to hear about 'herd immunity' all the time and how that was the goal, but we don't hear hardly anything about that anymore, do we?)
Is it really that odd that some people are using critical thinking and coming to the conclusion that maybe it's been a bit more rushed than they like to admit, especially for something they currently estimate to have maybe a 0.25% fatality rate?
I guess if they change the definitions of words we've been using to now mean something else, the 'science' can never be wrong.
Would you at least agree that they oversold us on what we could expect from these vaccines? We weren't originally told they will start to be 'less' effective after 6 months, but now we're being told that. Hell, the J & J vaccine is now suggesting BOOSTER shots after a mere 2 months to be properly 'protected.'
As someone said, and I'm just repeating, 'it's now a pandemic of the unvaccinated.' If that's correct, it seems fair to me. You choose not to get the vaccine, you're less 'protected' from it.
What about all the unvaccinated taking up hospital beds, you say? Well, using that logic, should we also start weighing people when they arrive at hospitals, and give heathy top priority and put the obese on the 'waiting list'?
Let's all just hope they haven't also changed the definitions for 'SAFE' and 'EFFECTIVE' as well, at least for the sake of our children.
Critical thinking should not be controversial.
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- JBTrain
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Re: Do you agree with mandatory vaccinations
As far as i know flu vaccines have always been called vaccines and have never been remotely close to 100 percent effective. I get them anyway. Random article is from 2012. I don't know what most people think a vaccine is. People who read newspapers in 2012 would know I guess.
https://www.cdc.gov/flu/vaccines-work/p ... mates.html
Pandemic among the unvaccinated is just great except for the finite number of beds and hospital workers attending to them when you need one and the there's no room at the inn
https://helenair.com/news/state-and-reg ... 21e95.html
You seem obsessed with fatality rate for reasons I don't understand. As if 700k dead is made better if more people are infected. It's the number of fucking people killed in WW1, 2, and Vietnam combined.
Effectiveness will obviously vary as new strains emerge. I'm repeating myself I think because I believe these points have been addressed.
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https://www.cdc.gov/flu/vaccines-work/p ... mates.html
Pandemic among the unvaccinated is just great except for the finite number of beds and hospital workers attending to them when you need one and the there's no room at the inn
https://helenair.com/news/state-and-reg ... 21e95.html
You seem obsessed with fatality rate for reasons I don't understand. As if 700k dead is made better if more people are infected. It's the number of fucking people killed in WW1, 2, and Vietnam combined.
Effectiveness will obviously vary as new strains emerge. I'm repeating myself I think because I believe these points have been addressed.
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Last edited by JBTrain on Thu Sep 23, 2021 2:51 am, edited 9 times in total.
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Re: Do you agree with mandatory vaccinations
Just a comment on critical thinking. It’s a skill that requires the use of tools and procedures if the interference of various cognitive biases is to be overcome
Despite what angsta states, it’s clear from reading through his posts that angsta supports the free FreePalestine movement.
- JBTrain
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Re: Do you agree with mandatory vaccinations
I didn't address herd immunity so I will here. Perhaps the reason one doesn't hear much about it is because in huge swaths of the US we are not going to come close to the vaccination percentages required to approach it , and these areas become breeding grounds for new variants to take hold and spread to highly vaccinated areas which might otherwise be better protected. Herd immunity has become unachievable and therefore irrelevant. These percentages are pitiful. Tell me they track "critical thinking" rather than News Max/FB news sourcing and Trump allegiance.General Mackevili wrote:I just have to point out that even the CDC's definition of 'VACCINATION' has recently changed...JBTrain wrote: ↑Sun Sep 19, 2021 5:53 pm You are correct, you don't apparently know what vaccination is for (seriously reducing risk of hospitalization and risk you'll transmit to others). Maybe read up on that for a start before throwing around the fascist card.
Sent from my Pixel 4a using Tapatalk
I think it's fair to say that if you asked people 2 years ago, 'what is a vaccine?' most people would say it prevents you from catching something/makes you immune to something, but now they've changed the definition of vaccine to more closely match the characteristics of the amazing COVID-19 vaccine.
The CDC used to say a vaccine would give you 'immunity,' now vaccines are just supposed to give you 'protection.'
I've already shown how they've recently changed the definition for 'herd immunity,' and now they've changed the definition for a vaccine. (It's also interesting how we used to hear about 'herd immunity' all the time and how that was the goal, but we don't hear hardly anything about that anymore, do we?)
Is it really that odd that some people are using critical thinking and coming to the conclusion that maybe it's been a bit more rushed than they like to admit, especially for something they currently estimate to have maybe a 0.25% fatality rate?
I guess if they change the definitions of words we've been using to now mean something else, the 'science' can never be wrong.
Would you at least agree that they oversold us on what we could expect from these vaccines? We weren't originally told they will start to be 'less' effective after 6 months, but now we're being told that. Hell, the J & J vaccine is now suggesting BOOSTER shots after a mere 2 months to be properly 'protected.'
As someone said, and I'm just repeating, 'it's now a pandemic of the unvaccinated.' If that's correct, it seems fair to me. You choose not to get the vaccine, you're less 'protected' from it.
What about all the unvaccinated taking up hospital beds, you say? Well, using that logic, should we also start weighing people when they arrive at hospitals, and give heathy top priority and put the obese on the 'waiting list'?
Let's all just hope they haven't also changed the definitions for 'SAFE' and 'EFFECTIVE' as well, at least for the sake of our children.
Critical thinking should not be controversial.
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Re: Do you agree with mandatory vaccinations
I posted this as it's own thread 3 weeks ago but it is very apt here
"You’re struggling to understand where all this vaccine hesitancy comes from. Let me help you."
BY KONSTANTIN KISIN
https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/news ... ntin-kisin
"You’re struggling to understand where all this vaccine hesitancy comes from. Let me help you."
BY KONSTANTIN KISIN
https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/news ... ntin-kisin
Imagine you’re a normal person. The year is 2016. Rightly or wrongly, you believe most of what you see in the media. You believe polls are broadly reflective of public opinion. You believe doctors and scientists are trustworthy and independent. You’re a decent, reasonable person who follows the rules and trusts the authorities.
- phuketrichard
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Re: Do you agree with mandatory vaccinations
so i understand, we should put a star on all those unvaccinated so they can readily be identified, correct?Anchor Moy wrote: ↑Wed Sep 22, 2021 9:57 pm Clearing up what I mean by "mandatory" Covid vaccines.
I voted yes for "mandatory" vaccines that will protect the general population, and in particular those most exposed to the virus such as health workers, so that we can get on with our lives, work, travel etc.
But I want to say that, (this should go without saying, but...) OF COURSE ,if you cannot be vaccinated, because you are allergic or pregnant or if you have a specific health condition, then you should not be vaccinated and you should not be shamed for that.
Summary: Yes I voted for mandatory vaccinations for people to protect themselves and protect us all, but, no, I do not want anyone to be vaccinated by force.
(But, I do want to know if I'm mixing with unvaccinated people or those who really don't give a shit, so I can stay clear.)
I can understand that some vaccinated workers may not want to work with unvaccinated workers, some customers also. Then what do you do ?
and the government should be the ones to Tell us to protect ourselves ( sorta like it mandatory in most places to wear a helmet or face a fine- unless it interferes with ur hairstyle if ur a sikh?)
Mandatory vaccinations mean just that, people are required to have the shot
The government is not in the business to tell me what i should or should not do with my body
In a nation run by swine, all pigs are upward-mobile and the rest of us are fucked until we can put our acts together: not necessarily to win, but mainly to keep from losing completely. HST
- JBTrain
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Re: Do you agree with mandatory vaccinations
Great thanks .IraHayes wrote:I posted this as it's own thread 3 weeks ago but it is very apt here
"You’re struggling to understand where all this vaccine hesitancy comes from. Let me help you."
BY KONSTANTIN KISIN
https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/news ... ntin-kisin
Imagine you’re a normal person. The year is 2016. Rightly or wrongly, you believe most of what you see in the media. You believe polls are broadly reflective of public opinion. You believe doctors and scientists are trustworthy and independent. You’re a decent, reasonable person who follows the rules and trusts the authorities.
Regarding Florida and Texas doing ok, if they were countries they'd be #11 and #17 in Covid death rate per capita. They'll soon pass Moldova and Italy respectively. (Mississippi would be second only to Peru). The fact that other states are worse is hardly a selling point for their policies.
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Re: Do you agree with mandatory vaccinations
@JBTrain "It's the number of fucking people killed in WW1, 2, and Vietnam combined."
Please note you are talking about US military losses only in these wars, and US losses pale by comparison to all non US deaths to the tune of 1 US military dead for every 10-20 non US military fatalities.
There's been some really outstanding input here from you Mr JBTrain and some others, your contributions are appreciated.
Please note you are talking about US military losses only in these wars, and US losses pale by comparison to all non US deaths to the tune of 1 US military dead for every 10-20 non US military fatalities.
There's been some really outstanding input here from you Mr JBTrain and some others, your contributions are appreciated.
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Re: Do you agree with mandatory vaccinations
Sorry my post was obviously tltr, so just read the big letters.phuketrichard wrote: ↑Thu Sep 23, 2021 7:03 amso i understand, we should put a star on all those unvaccinated so they can readily be identified, correct?Anchor Moy wrote: ↑Wed Sep 22, 2021 9:57 pm Clearing up what I mean by "mandatory" Covid vaccines.
I voted yes for "mandatory" vaccines that will protect the general population, and in particular those most exposed to the virus such as health workers, so that we can get on with our lives, work, travel etc.
But I want to say that, (this should go without saying, but...) OF COURSE ,if you cannot be vaccinated, because you are allergic or pregnant or if you have a specific health condition, then you should not be vaccinated and you should not be shamed for that.
Summary: Yes I voted for mandatory vaccinations for people to protect themselves and protect us all, but, no, I do not want anyone to be vaccinated by force.
(But, I do want to know if I'm mixing with unvaccinated people or those who really don't give a shit, so I can stay clear.)
I can understand that some vaccinated workers may not want to work with unvaccinated workers, some customers also. Then what do you do ?
and the government should be the ones to Tell us to protect ourselves ( sorta like it mandatory in most places to wear a helmet or face a fine- unless it interferes with ur hairstyle if ur a sikh?)
Mandatory vaccinations mean just that, people are required to have the shot
The government is not in the business to tell me what i should or should not do with my body
Holy fk. Words fail me.we should put a star on all those unvaccinated
- JBTrain
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Re: Do you agree with mandatory vaccinations
What government is forcing you to get a vaccine? Is the US? Thailand? Regulating your interaction with others, directly or through private employers/institutions in terms of work, travel, or public spaces, is not for your protection it's for the protection of others. You know this.. You have the right to consume alcohol but not the right to drive drunk.phuketrichard wrote:so i understand, we should put a star on all those unvaccinated so they can readily be identified, correct?Anchor Moy wrote: ↑Wed Sep 22, 2021 9:57 pm Clearing up what I mean by "mandatory" Covid vaccines.
I voted yes for "mandatory" vaccines that will protect the general population, and in particular those most exposed to the virus such as health workers, so that we can get on with our lives, work, travel etc.
But I want to say that, (this should go without saying, but...) OF COURSE ,if you cannot be vaccinated, because you are allergic or pregnant or if you have a specific health condition, then you should not be vaccinated and you should not be shamed for that.
Summary: Yes I voted for mandatory vaccinations for people to protect themselves and protect us all, but, no, I do not want anyone to be vaccinated by force.
(But, I do want to know if I'm mixing with unvaccinated people or those who really don't give a shit, so I can stay clear.)
I can understand that some vaccinated workers may not want to work with unvaccinated workers, some customers also. Then what do you do ?
and the government should be the ones to Tell us to protect ourselves ( sorta like it mandatory in most places to wear a helmet or face a fine- unless it interferes with ur hairstyle if ur a sikh?)
Mandatory vaccinations mean just that, people are required to have the shot
The government is not in the business to tell me what i should or should not do with my body
As far as helmet laws are concerned ..from the US Supreme Court case upholding the Massachusetts regulations:
"From the moment of the injury, society picks the person up off the highway; delivers him to a municipal hospital and municipal doctors; provides him with unemployment compensation if, after recovery, he cannot replace his lost job, and, if the injury causes permanent disability, may assume the responsibility for his and his family's continued subsistence. We do not understand a state of mind that permits plaintiff to think that only he himself is concerned".
The argument in Cambodia I understand is more tenuous given the almost non existent social safety net , not going to opine there.
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Last edited by JBTrain on Thu Sep 23, 2021 6:00 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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