america's involvement in Afghanistan closes

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Ahyou!whyme?
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Re: america's involvement in Afghanistan closes

Post by Ahyou!whyme? »

I'm not a Trump fan, and I hated some of his foreign policy, but he was on the right track in Afghanistan, by trying to do a deal with the Taliban. It's becoming clear now imo, that that was the best option for the US to get out. Better an on-side slowly moderating Islamic government, than an inept bunch of crooks which clearly the Afghanistani government were.
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Re: america's involvement in Afghanistan closes

Post by Ahyou!whyme? »

nemo wrote: Fri Aug 27, 2021 3:38 pm If they will not defend their own country and instead welcome a mob of fanatics to rule over them, I don't give many fucks.
How much more money needs to be wasted on them?
Let China be their BFF and help them with their Uighur issues.
What percentage of the Afghani population was in the armed forces ?

Am guessing from your post that it was most of them ?

What gives the impression that the Taliban had been welcomed in Kabul ? The scenes of stampedes to get to the airport, people queuing in sewers for days without food and water, falling 30,000 feet from planes and/or being crushed to death in wheel arches, risking being blown to bits by terrorists whilst trying to escape had given me the opposite impression. I could have missed something though.
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Re: america's involvement in Afghanistan closes

Post by Big Daikon »

Ahyou!whyme? wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 2:30 am I'm not a Trump fan, and I hated some of his foreign policy, but he was on the right track in Afghanistan, by trying to do a deal with the Taliban. It's becoming clear now imo, that that was the best option for the US to get out. Better an on-side slowly moderating Islamic government, than an inept bunch of crooks which clearly the Afghanistani government were.
Likewise with the secular dictatorships in the region. These regimes (Libya, Syria, etc) may be good for their respective nations and easier for us to work with.

And the US targets those leaders with scientific precision.
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Re: america's involvement in Afghanistan closes

Post by atst »

Ahyou!whyme? wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 2:36 am
nemo wrote: Fri Aug 27, 2021 3:38 pm If they will not defend their own country and instead welcome a mob of fanatics to rule over them, I don't give many fucks.
How much more money needs to be wasted on them?
Let China be their BFF and help them with their Uighur issues.
What percentage of the Afghani population was in the armed forces ?

Am guessing from your post that it was most of them ?

What gives the impression that the Taliban had been welcomed in Kabul ? The scenes of stampedes to get to the airport, people queuing in sewers for days without food and water, falling 30,000 feet from planes and/or being crushed to death in wheel arches, risking being blown to bits by terrorists whilst trying to escape had given me the opposite impression. I could have missed something though.
Can you imagine the queue at Phnom Penh airport with free flight's and Visa offered to the west. Apologize if this sounds a bit harsh. Where are the people who made millions from this mess?
I'm standing up, so I must be straight.
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Re: america's involvement in Afghanistan closes

Post by Ahyou!whyme? »

atst wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 3:40 am
Ahyou!whyme? wrote: Sat Aug 28, 2021 2:36 am
nemo wrote: Fri Aug 27, 2021 3:38 pm If they will not defend their own country and instead welcome a mob of fanatics to rule over them, I don't give many fucks.
How much more money needs to be wasted on them?
Let China be their BFF and help them with their Uighur issues.
What percentage of the Afghani population was in the armed forces ?

Am guessing from your post that it was most of them ?

What gives the impression that the Taliban had been welcomed in Kabul ? The scenes of stampedes to get to the airport, people queuing in sewers for days without food and water, falling 30,000 feet from planes and/or being crushed to death in wheel arches, risking being blown to bits by terrorists whilst trying to escape had given me the opposite impression. I could have missed something though.
Can you imagine the queue at Phnom Penh airport with free flight's and Visa offered to the west. Apologize if this sounds a bit harsh. Where are the people who made millions from this mess?
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Re: america's involvement in Afghanistan closes

Post by Clutch Cargo »

nemo wrote: Fri Aug 27, 2021 3:38 pm If they will not defend their own country and instead welcome a mob of fanatics to rule over them, I don't give many fucks.
How much more money needs to be wasted on them?
Let China be their BFF and help them with their Uighur issues.
Like it or not, the 'mob of fanatics' aka Taliban were in power when the US invaded the country in 2001 on the basis the Taliban would not hand over al-Qaeda terrorists nor give up support for them. Hence the US set up an alternative government.

Which begs the question: did the Afghan population want/approve the change in government or not? Whilst the US saw the Taliban as harbouring terrorists, and therefore tarred them with the same brush, maybe most of the rest of the population didn't see it that way. Certainly when it came to the army 'defending their country' from the Taliban when the US pulled out.

The other thing is: was it necessary to invade to country to bring the terrorists to account. Because when the US invaded, most of al-Qaeda terrorists fled to Pakistan and the mountains. Bin Laden was killed in 2011 in Pakistan. What was left seemed to be a war with the Taliban.

Could there have been another way to target al-Qaeda terrorists without an invasion and overthrow of an existing government? With all the whizz bang technology and intelligence these days maybe that would've been more effective.

This is just speculation on my part, but putting it out there..

In any event, the basis for this war was pretty murky as explained here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_St ... is_for_war
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Re: america's involvement in Afghanistan closes

Post by Kammekor »

xandreu wrote: Fri Aug 27, 2021 3:23 pm

Again, it just doesn't add up...
I read somewhere the Afghan military hadn't been paid their salaries for the last seven months. Who wants to risk his life for free?
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Re: america's involvement in Afghanistan closes

Post by Clutch Cargo »

“There will be no victory in this war, illusory or otherwise.” These prescient words foretold the future of the US effort in Afghanistan. They were written by the former head of station for the CIA in Islamabad, Robert L. Grenier in his 2015 book 88 Days to Kandahar.

Grenier was the architect of the initial and successful US invasion of Afghanistan in the aftermath of the terrorist attacks on the US on September 11, 2001.

Grenier’s plan is the reason the US quickly ousted the Taliban from power and evicted al-Qaeda from Afghanistan. Grenier warned at the time that if the US sought to occupy the country and change Afghanistan’s political culture to a democracy from a tribal-based society, especially given the Taliban are part of the majority Pashtuns, a costly and tragic failure would ensue.

And now we have the proof. The loss of life is tragic. The length of the US commitment was folly. The scenes of abandoned Afghan allies deplorable. The message to other US allies alarming.
Extract: https://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/world/ ... 58mh7.html
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Re: america's involvement in Afghanistan closes

Post by phuketrichard »

did Hilary have it right ages ago?

In a nation run by swine, all pigs are upward-mobile and the rest of us are fucked until we can put our acts together: not necessarily to win, but mainly to keep from losing completely. HST
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Re: america's involvement in Afghanistan closes

Post by atst »

Why is it that every reporter interviewing people representing the Taliban are female reporters :stir:
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