RIP to the young victim.

We don't know what caused that young woman's death, but, because she was drinking rice wine, my immediate thoughts were that she should have been made to vomit. But, since I'm no doctor, I checked out the methanol website, where they suggest giving victims (of methanol poisoning) some REAL ALCOHOL containing ethanol. See below. I am definitely not advising people to do this, but was wondering if anyone here has heard of this "treatment" for methanol poisoning, or if someone could shed some light on whether this would more likely kill or cure the patient ?

Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) on Methanol Poisonings & Treatment
1. Why would people add methanol to alcoholic beverages?Methanol is often deliberately and illegally added to alcoholic beverages as a cheaper alternative to ethanol (normal alcohol that can be consumed) in countries where taxes on legitimate alcohol or the cost of legitimate alcohol might be perceived as too high.

2. How are people usually poisoned from drinking adulterated alcohol? Methanol poisonings by direct consumption occur when unscrupulous enterprises or individuals add industrial methanol into legitimate alcoholic beverages. The poisonings can also be caused through improper brewing of homemade alcohol, which produces methanol instead of ethanol. This alcohol is either consumed directly or mixed in with legitimate spirits, again as a cheaper and/or more potent alternative to ethanol.

3. SymptomsWhen methanol is ingested into the body, it is converted into formaldehyde and then into formic acid, which causes a person’s blood to become acidic (metabolic acidosis). Methanol poisoning in its early stages might be difficult to distinguish from inebriation from normal ethanol consumption. Severe symptoms do not usually occur until 12-24 hours after consumption and can include: abdominal pain, nausea, vomiting, breathing difficulty, blindness, blurred vision, seizures, and/or comas.
4. How much consumption of methanol is fatal?Drinking just 25-90 mL (0.7-3.0 ounces) of methanol can be fatal without proper medical treatment. Since methanol is an industrial chemical, it should not be consumed in any quantity, just as people would normally not mix gasoline or other industrial chemicals into legitimate alcoholic beverages.

5. How to treat methanol poisoning?Methanol poisoning can be treated successfully if diagnosed within 10-30 hours of ingestion.

If you suspect someone might have methanol poisoning, get them to a hospital which has dialysis equipment as soon as possible. Fomepizole is used to inhibit methanol metabolism and is highly effective, but might not be readily available in many markets. If Fomepizole is not available, begin to give the person high doses of ethanol (i.e., whisky, vodka, etc.) immediately. A person’s liver will process ethanol first instead of methanol, delaying the onset of methanol poisoning and allowing for more time to process methanol out of a person’s system.
Administration of sodium bicarbonate can also neutralize formic acid and maintains proper pH balance. Ultimately, a patient may need tobe put on dialysis to ensure the most comprehensive removal of methanol from his/her system.

(www.methanol.org). You can also contact Dom LaVigne at MI (+65 6325 6302 / [email protected]).
https://www.methanol.org/wp-content/upl ... eneral.pdf

John Bingham wrote: ↑Sat Jul 03, 2021 12:35 am

ofparadise wrote: ↑Sat Jul 03, 2021 12:11 am Even if the doctors or facilities were inadequate, they should have admitted her instead of leaving her to die on the streets. Pass the hot pocket.

Why should they if, as I mentioned, they are already overstretched and have queues of people trying to get into A&E? Let her in and let her languish in the hall for hours because the staff are all busy as hell already? It's all very well having high ideals about what should or shouldn't be done, in real life the staff have to be more pragmatic.

Pragmatism works if there's a social and legal system waiting to step in. When that is absent, pragmatism is only an "Ideal" for medical practitioners. You have to make do with what you have otherwise.

Another point I'd like to add, is medical facilities are businesses. Investors and stakeholders set the framework in small companies like those present here in the city.

Wow, if you get poisoned drinking home brew you can possibly save your life by getting blind drunk on premium brand spirits

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xandreu wrote: ↑Sat Jul 03, 2021 12:03 am Of the few times I have had to visit a doctor here in PP, (nothing too serious so far thankfully) I have always had the impression that the doctor expects me to know more about my condition than they do.

True story - I had a rather large lump on my head (in my hair so it wasn't particularly visible) that had been growing very, very slowly over several years. It started even before I left for Cambodia. It didn't cause me a problem and being a typical guy, if it didn't hurt and it wasn't particularly visible, I just kinda ignored it. Until one day a friend of mine persuaded me to go to a clinic in PP to get it looked at.

I guess my main concern was whether it was cancerous or not - I doubted it because as far as I know, cancer works much faster than the several years it took for this egg shaped thing in my hair to grow. I was given quite a thorough ultra-scan by. woman who was making a half-hearted attempt to show me what it was on the screen, but I can never make out those black-and-white images they use for baby scans etc.

All I wanted to know was whether it was dangerous or not. Was it going to cause me a problem? If it's not cancerous now, how likely is it to turn cancerous in the future. All pretty reasonable questions I though. So I asked the scanner-lady at the end 'What do you think? Is it dangerous? Is it likely to cause me and issue? She literally shrugged her shoulders and said "Maybe. It might do. But it might not." and with that she slapped her gloves off, gave me some towels to wipe the gunky stuff off my hair and left the room.

My friend and I were left wondering if/when she would return. She didn't. We went back down to reception and were charged $60 for the privilege of having absolutely zero extra knowledge of my condition than when we walked in there.

I could recall many other cases where doctors seem wary of giving too much information about the condition you've gone there to see them for, and I always suspect that it's because they're scared you might know more about your condition than they do and they don't want to look foolish. I've even been to doctors before now and after explaining my symptoms, been told "What do you want me to do about it?" - I don't know. Forgive me but aren't YOU the doctor and I'M the patient? How about you tell me what needs to be done??!!

I know they say that healthcare in general is improving in Cambodia. Perhaps I just need to stop being so tight and paying to see properly qualified and well recommended doctors.

You should have gone to a vet for treatment. I have a great respect for those people. They don't ask their patients any questions and they use their diagnosis skills
to solve the problem.

Ti_Rod wrote: ↑Sat Jul 03, 2021 3:15 am Wow, if you get poisoned drinking home brew you can possibly save your life by getting blind drunk on premium brand spirits
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Are you SUPER confident about that ?
Drunk THEN blind, actually.

Super Duper Premium Delirium

John Bingham wrote:

ofparadise wrote: ↑Sat Jul 03, 2021 12:11 am Even if the doctors or facilities were inadequate, they should have admitted her instead of leaving her to die on the streets. Pass the hot pocket.

Why should they if, as I mentioned, they are already overstretched and have queues of people trying to get into A&E? Let her in and let her languish in the hall for hours because the staff are all busy as hell already? It's all very well having high ideals about what should or shouldn't be done, in real life the staff have to be more pragmatic.

I don't think that's accurate at all and you're letting them off the hook way tope easily. They're simply scared of Covid and passing responsibility around/don't want a potential death registered there. The ERs aren't full, as that'd not where Wuflu patients are held. This sort of thing has happened many times pre COVID-19: if you look poor or in bad enough health on arrival, you're turned away.

Perhaps, if they had gone directly to the larger hospitals here. Like Royal. Maybe they may have been able to help since they claim to be the best-equipped hospital in town. And they cannot reasonably assume that the patient would receive better care elsewhere, But this is only speculation. It might have been the first stop.

I hope the press, names the hospitals and clinics that refused these guys, and the tuk-tuk driver in another thread today. That culture might be a good start. Name the places.

This is such a fixable problem. Some national outrage might go a long way.

I had an episode of heart failure due to arrhythmia. My landlord bundled me into the back of his pickup and dropped me off at the Siem Reap Provincial Hospital. I was in a public ward with about 50 beds, all full and I was expecting the worst. But the medical care was first class, I was on a drip straight away and all sorts of drugs were pumped into me.The staff there saved my life, and it cost me $100 for a 2 week stay. As the only barang in a ward full of khmers, I was a constant source of amusement especially when I had to urinate into a small bucket in full view of everybody (being bedridden). Luckily my gf was with me, washed me, fed me, slept on the floor beside my bed every night. What I am saying is that maybe its a problem in PP, but in SR even the basic facilities are pretty good.

ofparadise wrote:Perhaps, if they had gone directly to the larger hospitals here. Like Royal. Maybe they may have been able to help since they claim to be the best-equipped hospital in town. And they cannot reasonably assume that the patient would receive better care elsewhere, But this is only speculation. It might have been the first stop.

I hope the press, names the hospitals and clinics that refused these guys, and the tuk-tuk driver in another thread today. That culture might be a good start. Name the places.

This is such a fixable problem. Some national outrage might go a long way.

I'm assuming you're new here. Royal Phnom Penh are a private hospital and likely also wouldn't taken in some local girl who doesn't have a wad of cash handy or good/valid insurance off of a tuktuk, nor would the girl's friends even think of bringing her there. Private hospitals do this all the time, that's why they likely visited public one (as mentioned in the article). What's more shocking is numerous public hospitals batting them away as if they were flies.