NZ, Australia - into winter with Covid-19

Kahuna · Post by **Kahuna** » Sat Aug 21, 2021 11:03 am

Mate of mine went to the casino and the day after he got there the Vietnamese government introduced a strict no travel lockdown. He's been there for 6 weeks and looks like 2 more weeks to go as restrictions have been extended due to the situation in various cities and provinces. Having said that he is a VIP member at the casino so it's free beers, breakfast to his door and then 2 buffet meals and free ocean view room. He said it's not too bad as he is now allowed to go outside and walk the 1 klm perimeter of the hotel which before they were restricted to only inside.
As for his VIP status, the rewards system they have in place is very generous and he doesn't spend a lot to keep the points accruing which are then exchanged for the room etc. He got a $2600 USD jackpot the other night which basically gave him the points for 2 weeks.
He was thinking of going back to Melbourne Australia but the recent resetting of returnee numbers back home and that we are going get the vaccine here shortly has changed his mind for now. I'll wait until life returns to the possibly "new normal" before I go back which will be........?

SternAAlbifrons · Post by **SternAAlbifrons** » Sat Aug 21, 2021 1:13 pm

It's not about keeping it out at this stage, it's about suppressing it until most people get vaccinated.
Finally... that has stepped up bigtime.
It seems to be that Au's approach turned out to be pretty good. They virtually skipped the most deadly phase.
And the damage to the economy, faith in the governments and social cohesion all seem to much better than across the developed world average.

I just cycled over to check out the anti vax protest (see Yobbo's post last page)
The cops cut most people off at the pass - patrolling/checking all the Sydney city entry points. A few 100 got in.
(No wuckers for this old smuggler.)

'Curious mix - your usual right wing, shaven/short haircut, fatty muscle-boys and their peroxided girls. Waving the Australian flag - code for White People Only in their dumbflock tiny minds.
Plus, the most wacko of the New Age wacko's.

Only one single responsible traditional lefty/greenie type - and he was standing off to the side sneering and sniggering at them with his new best mates, the cops. that was me.

orussey98 · Post by **orussey98** » Sat Aug 21, 2021 1:24 pm

SternAAlbifrons wrote: ↑Sat Aug 21, 2021 1:13 pm
Only one single responsible traditional lefty/greenie type - and he was standing off to the side sneering and sniggering at them with his new best mates, the cops. that was me.

Responsible lefty that's new.

SternAAlbifrons · Post by **SternAAlbifrons** » Sat Aug 21, 2021 1:37 pm

Yeah, the young cops loved me.
I gave then a full florid in-depth history lesson of the glory days of the anti-Vietnam War and anti-Aparteid protest battles of old - against guys just like them.
You could just see the envy dripping - Ohhhh i wish we could have been around in those days too

Anyway, now we're all best mates.

Didnya know, Orussey? responsible lefties have been stopping Vietnam wars and apartheid regimes et al - for ever.

orussey98 · Post by **orussey98** » Sat Aug 21, 2021 1:50 pm

SternAAlbifrons wrote: ↑Sat Aug 21, 2021 1:37 pm Yeah, the young cops loved me.
I gave then a full florid in-depth history lesson of the glory days of the anti-Vietnam War and anti-Aparteid protest battles of old - against guys just like them.
You could just see the envy dripping - Ohhhh i wish we could have been around in those days too

Anyway, now we're all best mates.

Didnya know, Orussey? responsible lefties have been stopping Vietnam wars and apartheid regimes et al - for ever.

I can't tell if you are serious or if you are joking

SternAAlbifrons · Post by **SternAAlbifrons** » Sat Aug 21, 2021 1:56 pm

Both.

(ps, i certainly didn't mean that the new young cops wished they could have been there to join in the Vietnam etc protests.
they wished they were there to kick protestors teeth, incl mine.
We still joked about it - and left with huge grins and mutual respect)

Check the next big public brawl you see Orussay, if there is some bloke there with a huge fat grin trying to make jokes with the other team - while still throwing punches - that's me.

"Love thine Enemy" - my creed.

Post by **Clutch Cargo** » Sat Aug 21, 2021 4:19 pm

SternAAlbifrons wrote: ↑Sat Aug 21, 2021 1:13 pm It's not about keeping it out at this stage, it's about suppressing it until most people get vaccinated.
When did the change to the policy of zero covid tolerance come about? AFAIK it's still in place and the PM has stated the restrictions won't be lifted until 70% of the population is vaxed

Finally... that has stepped up bigtime.
Belatedly and only because there are bigger outbreaks in Sydney, Melb and Canb and now with the Delta variant. The one in Sydney looks like it can't be totally suppressed. Before when outbreaks were better controlled and the zero covid tolerance was working, many people didn't see the point in rushing to get vaxed. Now it's in their community and they are getting scared and hence the step up.

It seems to be that Au's approach turned out to be pretty good. They virtually skipped the most deadly phase.
Def in terms of saving livings but there has been some very harsh (some would say illegal) associated restrictions incl. preventing Australians from returning home leaving many stranded overseas (some of whom have died eg India). And, they've made the place a prison preventing Australians from leaving the country.

And the damage to the economy,
On the surface, it looks like it has done well, our exports have held up well, the price of iron ore is up and China hasn't boycotted that (yet). But let's not forget, budget debt has blown out big time. The RBA have been busy printing fiat $$ and issuing and buying gov't bonds to fund the gov't paying people to stay at home. That debt will have to be repaid eventually and the can has been kicked way down the road for the young generation to repay. And with housing prices gone crazy and rents now increasing significantly, I feel for the lack of opportunity this will cause for the next generation.

faith in the governments
Yes, they've kept people 'safe' but with draconian, hermit nation policies. And they well and truly f**ked up the vaccine rollout. Nearly every other western country has done better than Aus/NZ on this and they are now lifting lockdowns and restrictions. Sorry, I also don't have much faith in governments that prevents it's citizens from returning home and leaving if they wish to.

and social cohesion all seem to much better than across the developed world average.
Well maybe I'm not sure on that without benchmark measures. What I do know anecdotally that some of my small business friends are very p*ssed off with these rolling lockdowns and the slow vax rollout. From what I've read recently re the Sydney outbreak, and it seemingly being out of control, is because people are not following covid directions. I suspect they are fed up with it all. Can't be good for your mental health to be stuck at home unable to work or freely move about on an ongoing basis.

With respect I think your glass is half full on this Stern

Nevertheless, I respect your view and opinion and that may be proven to be right in the longer term. I'm just providing a different point of view as I see it. For discussion purpose only

SternAAlbifrons · Post by **SternAAlbifrons** » Sat Aug 21, 2021 5:39 pm

Fair enough, Clutch. I can understand that viewpoint.
But the vast majority of australians beg to differ.
It's just their way of doing it, and they are (mostly) quite fine about it. Of course there is a lot of debate - and increasingly - but it is virtually all around the edges, the details of how to play it as it unfolds. But very little debate around the basic plans.

With due respect, i think some of your interps are a bit jaded.
I won't address the particular, but anybody who thinks Australia has been turned into a prison - or that Australians are susceptible to become mindless drone/slaves has got rocks in their heads. imo
It's called consensus. That's one of the things Oz has got on a few vital social issues that other western democracies are fast loosing.

One more point that i reckon is pertinent.
Australia handled the AIDS epidemic better than anybody on virtually all fronts.
They had very high numbers of all the at-risk populations. Gay men, IV drug users, sex workers and transfusion poeple. And excellent vectors for spread.

Something about good practical basic science education (very good at junior levels)
- combined with aussies genuine, down to earth, practicality. Common sense. They are famous for it.
So they grasp the basic principles of epidemiology and just - do it.
Bugger a few sacrifices - winging is for snowflakes!

Very little politicising of the whole thing too, certainly not like in other places. That definitely helps a "sensiblist" approach coming thru.
And maybe.. ?? they have more of a fiercely protective attitude towards every single grandmother than some other societies (really) have. that is definitely a big part of aussies demand that it be suppressed.

(hey Clutch, as a kiwi that has dedicated much of his life to living in Au and poking fun at it - i assure you this is not a hagiography.
Just my objective-as-i-can view of it all. ffs. I want to get out of here too.)

Post by **Clutch Cargo** » Sat Aug 21, 2021 8:17 pm

Very little politicising of the whole thing too, certainly not like in other places. That definitely helps a "sensiblist" approach coming thru.
And maybe.. ?? they have more of a fiercely protective attitude towards every single grandmother than some other societies (really) have. that is definitely a big part of aussies demand that it be suppressed.

I don't know that as you say: 'aussies demanded it'.. I don't recall any debate about it. The government just went ahead and foisted it on the people whether they liked it or not..no doubt thinking the mantra: 'keeping people safe' is a sure fire election winner.

And when you use the word 'suppressed', that is not the same as the zero covid tolerance policy that the gov't instituted. Suppressing covid is one thing, total eradication is another, there's an important difference there and how that plays out in the community.

Now, how much debate has there been about the debt that has been racked up in 'keeping people safe' while the economy has been in shut down internally and the effect on future generations? The baby boomers don't care right coz the debt can has been kicked down the road and they're OK with their owned houses and superannuation or payments from the gov't to stay at home.

Sadly, I think the young generation mostly has no idea what has been inflicted upon them in terms of future eventual higher taxes, higher interest rates, less social services resulting from these current draconian lockdown economic policies and closed borders. That will be a problem for future generations that seems to be ignored coz it doesn't affect people right now and is out of sight. Where is the debate about that? Shame Australia!

Of course had they not stuffed up the vaccine rollout and convinced the people that zero covid meant they didn't need the vaccine, then Australia could have moved on faster from their current predicament without the high degree of restrictions on freedom.

SternAAlbifrons · Post by **SternAAlbifrons** » Sun Aug 22, 2021 1:25 am

With due respect again Clutch - sincerely.

The ONLY people i hear "Australia has become a prison" "Shame Australia" garbage from are the radicals.
The anti vaxxers and the anti maskers.
The piddling few who support the demos yesterday.
The lunar right and the lunar wacko's.

Yes we are increasingly hearing this - from a few tiny percent.
- those who are enamoured by alien imported Trumpianism plus a few tie-dyed T-shirt wearing "micro-doser" casualties.
Australia rejects that shit outright. Sorry.

NO BODY else in Australia talks like this.
May i ask who you have been talking to?

PS If you didn't hear australians demand suppression you have a remarkably tin ear, my friend
The politicians don't. That is why support for every single government in australia has risen despite all the woes and and the hash measures.
Equally - most conservative responsible economists think Au made good choices, (as much as they agree on anything). But you are of course free to argue with them if you can.

Although not one myself - i have confidence that i speak in total accordance with the vast majority of Australians on this.

NZ, Australia - into winter with Covid-19

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Re: NZ, Australia - into winter with Cv-19

Re: NZ, Australia - into winter with Cv-19

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Re: NZ, Australia - into winter with Cv-19

Re: NZ, Australia - into winter with Cv-19

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