Following the Coronavirus (COVID-19) Outbreak - News and Discussion

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theKid
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Re: Corona in Temple Town?

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Jerry Atrick wrote: Wed Oct 07, 2020 2:00 pm
mehfisto wrote: Wed Oct 07, 2020 12:30 pm " Simultaneously, the occasional case also is of no concern to my family or myself as it is quite evident that it is nowhere near as serious as English language media would have us believe."

Over a million dead people say you're wrong.

And the many others who survived with nasty long-term effects.
There are over 7800000000 people on the planet.

1.05m have died with covid and other comorbidity factors.

Statistically insignificant.

Here in Cambodia, as any other year, I'm far more concerned about dengue, malaria and chikungunya, with the latter responsible for 7000 plus reported infections in Cambodia this year so far.
The question is what would have happened if the world would have treated the threat of Covid like “just another fairly harmless virus”. What would that figure be if none of the current drastic measures would have been taken. What if tourism, air travel, commuting, large scale events (festivals, concerts, sports, exhibitions etc) and general every day life activities would have continued worldwide in the past 6 months. And what if there weren’t billions put into therapy research, PPE and ventilator production? No one knows but it’s reasonable to assume that the number could be significantly higher.
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Re: Corona in Temple Town?

Post by mehfisto »

Jerry Atrick wrote: Wed Oct 07, 2020 2:24 pm
mehfisto wrote: Wed Oct 07, 2020 2:13 pm 'There are over 7800000000 people on the planet.

1.05m have died with covid and other comorbidity factors.

Statistically insignificant.'

Your statement implies it is over and the 1 million plus total is the final figure.

Question: is it over?

You know the answer.

My point: we can only use statistics to determine significance when we know the final total.

Any implication you take from my prior post is your own. I implied nothing.
I think your post very definitely compares diseases based on total deaths, but disregards the fact that Covid is not over, and that anything could happen in the future. If we compare Spanish flu (which is over, I think we all agree) with Covid 19, (which is extant and definitely not over), don't you think the logic is flawed and the comparison is also?

We don't know the final number.

In addition, the world reacted to Covid 19 in a much more active way than they did to Spanish flu. One could posit that if the world had reacted to Spanish flu in the same way we reacted to Covid, perhaps less than 1 million would have died. Ergo, Covid 19 would be more dangerous. It's fatuous reasoning.
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Re: Corona in Temple Town?

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mehfisto wrote: Wed Oct 07, 2020 12:30 pm " Simultaneously, the occasional case also is of no concern to my family or myself as it is quite evident that it is nowhere near as serious as English language media would have us believe."

Over a million dead people say you're wrong.

And the many others who survived with nasty long-term effects.
my thread;
Long covid
topic40989.html
In a nation run by swine, all pigs are upward-mobile and the rest of us are fucked until we can put our acts together: not necessarily to win, but mainly to keep from losing completely. HST
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Re: Corona in Temple Town?

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mehfisto wrote: Wed Oct 07, 2020 2:13 pm 'There are over 7800000000 people on the planet.

1.05m have died with covid and other comorbidity factors.

Statistically insignificant.'.

In addition, the world reacted to Covid 19 in a much more active way than they did to Spanish flu. One could posit that if the world had reacted to Spanish flu in the same way we reacted to Covid, perhaps less than 1 million would have died. Ergo, Covid 19 would be more dangerous. It's fatuous reasoning.


100 years ago human population levels were ~ 30% of modern day levels (1900m plus change).

Most of humanity of that Era (75%+) lived in rural, low density environments. Mass transit was a new and small industry before the explosion of air travel.

In short, it was not the world in which we live today.

So, to even consider that it was possible for the world in 1920 to lock down in the same manner and for the same reasons is a great example of fatuous reasoning by yourself.

If we look at Belarus this year , for example, it was not because of a lockdown that they swerved the effects most strongly seen in countries like the UK, US, Italy, France and Spain. It was because they 1: have over ten beds in hospital for every 1000 citizens (as opposed to 2.5/4 in US and UK hospitals), and 2: most aged/vulnerable folk were not in kill zone care homes, but in their own apartments or rural homes.

This despite mass protests and civil unrest, demonstrations practically all year.
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Re: Following the Coronavirus (COVID-19) Outbreak - News and Discussion

Post by clutchcargo »

Trump is still comparing COVID-19 to the flu. But the coronavirus has already killed 3 times more people than flu does in a year.

Image

President Trump tweeted on Tuesday that the coronavirus was “far less lethal” than the flu in most populations, adding that “sometimes over 100,000” people die from the flu.

Both claims are false: The most Americans who have ever died from the flu in one season is 61,000. The coronavirus’ death rate in the US is also far higher than the flu’s.

Facebook removed and Twitter flagged Trump’s post for violating misinformation policies.

Full article with details and stats: https://www.businessinsider.com.au/trum ... ty-2020-10

Facebook just removed Trump's post falsely claiming that COVID-19 is less deadly than the flu

Full article: https://www.businessinsider.com.au/face ... lu-2020-10
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Re: Following the Coronavirus (COVID-19) Outbreak - News and Discussion

Post by phuketrichard »

concerning the above


Identify the Different Symptoms of the Flu and Covid-19

With fears of a “twindemic” in the United States this fall, here’s a guide to understanding what’s making you feel terrible.
As influenza season approaches, some Americans, and especially parents, are worried that, if they or their children should become ill, it may not be easy to know which disease they have — the flu or Covid-19.

They are correct. Most symptoms of the two diseases are so similar that, short of a test — or two or three tests — it won’t be possible to know for sure. But there are some clues. (And it is possible to have both infections at the same time; some patients in China this year were found to have both.)
Nonetheless, experts urge all Americans to get flu shots. Before it ended abruptly during lockdown, last year’s flu season was on track to be one of the worst in recent memory. The number of children who died was equal to that in the 2017-18 season, which was the worst since the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention began tracking flu-season deaths in 1976.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/03/at-h ... XXlsHlTeVg
In a nation run by swine, all pigs are upward-mobile and the rest of us are fucked until we can put our acts together: not necessarily to win, but mainly to keep from losing completely. HST
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Re: Corona in Temple Town?

Post by mehfisto »

Jerry Atrick wrote: Wed Oct 07, 2020 4:22 pm So, to even consider that it was possible for the world in 1920 to lock down in the same manner and for the same reasons is a great example of fatuous reasoning by yourself.
Hahaha, I'm glad you understand the flaw in my reasoning trap. It's precisely the same reasoning you used comparing other deadly diseases and an unfinished event.

I"m in Siam Reap. Beer?
Jerry Atrick
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Re: Corona in Temple Town?

Post by Jerry Atrick »

mehfisto wrote: Wed Oct 07, 2020 5:52 pm
Jerry Atrick wrote: Wed Oct 07, 2020 4:22 pm So, to even consider that it was possible for the world in 1920 to lock down in the same manner and for the same reasons is a great example of fatuous reasoning by yourself.
Hahaha, I'm glad you understand the flaw in my reasoning trap. It's precisely the same reasoning you used comparing other deadly diseases and an unfinished event.

I"m in Siam Reap. Beer?
In Kampot, will be up there next month, if you're out.
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Re: Following the Coronavirus (COVID-19) Outbreak - News and Discussion

Post by CEOCambodiaNews »

phuketrichard wrote: Wed Oct 07, 2020 5:31 pm concerning the above


Identify the Different Symptoms of the Flu and Covid-19

With fears of a “twindemic” in the United States this fall, here’s a guide to understanding what’s making you feel terrible.
As influenza season approaches, some Americans, and especially parents, are worried that, if they or their children should become ill, it may not be easy to know which disease they have — the flu or Covid-19.

They are correct. Most symptoms of the two diseases are so similar that, short of a test — or two or three tests — it won’t be possible to know for sure. But there are some clues. (And it is possible to have both infections at the same time; some patients in China this year were found to have both.)
Nonetheless, experts urge all Americans to get flu shots. Before it ended abruptly during lockdown, last year’s flu season was on track to be one of the worst in recent memory. The number of children who died was equal to that in the 2017-18 season, which was the worst since the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention began tracking flu-season deaths in 1976.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/03/at-h ... XXlsHlTeVg
More on how to tell if it's flu or covid:
Coronavirus Disease 2019 vs. the Flu
Reviewed By: Lisa Lockerd Maragakis, M.D., M.P.H.

Influenza (the flu) and COVID-19, the illness caused by the pandemic coronavirus, are both contagious respiratory illnesses, meaning they affect your lungs and breathing, and can be spread to others. Although the symptoms of COVID-19 and the flu can look similar, the two illnesses are caused by different viruses.
Lisa Maragakis, M.D., M.P.H., senior director of infection prevention at Johns Hopkins, explains how the flu and COVID-19 are similar and how they are different.

Both illnesses can cause fever, cough, body aches, and sometimes vomiting and diarrhea (especially in children). Learn more about COVID-19 symptoms.
Both can result in pneumonia.
Both flu and COVID-19 can be mild or severe, or even fatal in rare cases.

How It Spreads

Both the flu and COVID-19 spread in similar ways. Droplets or smaller virus particles from a sick person can transmit the virus to other people nearby. The smallest particles may linger in the air, and another person can inhale them and become infected.
Or, people can touch a surface with viruses on it, and then transfer the germs to themselves by touching their face.
People infected with the coronavirus or the flu may not realize they are sick for several days, and during that time can unknowingly spread the disease to others before they even feel sick.

Treatment

Neither the flu nor COVID-19 is treatable with antibiotics, which only work on bacterial infections.
Both are treated by addressing symptoms, such as reducing fever. Severe cases may require hospitalization and very ill patients may need a ventilator — a machine that helps them breathe.
Antiviral medications may shorten the duration of both illnesses.

Prevention

Both can be prevented by mask-wearing, frequent and thorough hand washing, coughing into the crook of your elbow, staying home when sick and limiting contact with people who are infected. Physical distancing limits the spread of COVID-19 in communities.

Fall and winter months bring the flu season. Here is what you need to know to help protect you and your family from the flu and COVID-19.

COVID-19: Caused by the 2019 coronavirus, also known as SARS-CoV-2.

Flu: Caused by any of several different types and strains of influenza viruses. Different strains circulate each year.
Symptoms

COVID-19: Many people infected with the coronavirus do not feel sick or have any symptoms at all, but they can still transmit the coronavirus to other people. Review the full list of symptoms.

Unlike the flu, COVID-19 can sometimes cause a person to suddenly lose their sense of smell (anosmia) or taste (ageusia).

Flu: Flu does not typically affect a person’s sense of smell or taste.
Treatment

COVID-19: Antiviral medications and other therapies are being tested to see if they can effectively address symptoms and shorten the duration of the illness. Currently, effective treatments are only available in an intravenous form, so they are not prescribed to patients outside of a hospital setting.

Flu: Oral antiviral medications can address symptoms and sometimes shorten the duration of the illness. Because they are given by mouth, these antiviral therapies can be prescribed for patients who are not hospitalized as well as for those in the hospital.
Vaccine

COVID-19: No vaccine is available at this time, though development and testing are in progress.

Flu: A vaccine is available and effective in preventing some of the most dangerous types or to reduce the severity or duration of the flu. It is very important to get vaccinated for the flu this year.
https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/ ... vs-the-flu
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Re: Following the Coronavirus (COVID-19) Outbreak - News and Discussion

Post by newkidontheblock »

theKid wrote:The question is what would have happened if the world would have treated the threat of Covid like “just another fairly harmless virus”. What would that figure be if none of the current drastic measures would have been taken. What if tourism, air travel, commuting, large scale events (festivals, concerts, sports, exhibitions etc) and general every day life activities would have continued worldwide in the past 6 months. And what if there weren’t billions put into therapy research, PPE and ventilator production? No one knows but it’s reasonable to assume that the number could be significantly higher.
I agree.

The world couldn’t treat it like another fairly harmless virus BECAUSE it put such a high number people into the ICUs requiring ventilators and other critical resources for a long time. Even first world countries medical systems were overwhelmed.

If the world did nothing and the medical systems stopped functioning, then in first world countries maybe 20-30% would have died agonizingly slowly, another 30% would have permanent disabilities after recovery. This is on top of the many who would die or be disabled because there is no more medical system to take care of them.

There are mass riots over the shooting death of 1 person in the US. Imagine the chaos in a virus overrun world without medical care?
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