Koh Rong Samloem
Re: Koh Rong Samloem
I agree that multiple spellings can be "correct" but apparently the current spelling implies a different sound completely, which I think would make it incorrect if true. And how is the BBC supposed to decide when they write about the place?JBTrain wrote:There is no wrong in Anglicized Khmer. Look at highway signs or other government funded projects and you'll see myriad spellings for the same place. There is no official bible, it's not the BBC.
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Re: Koh Rong Samloem
It has 'helicopters'. Great for playing
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Re: Koh Rong Samloem
I believe the 'O' means creek / river. Same for O'Tres.Username Taken wrote:Not sure about the 'O', but the chheauteal refers to the Tiel tree.Jaap N. wrote:I've been wondering about that name, 'Ochheuteal'. What does it mean?CharlieHarpersBar wrote:Mind you, I've seen many different spellings of Ochheuteal on the road signs directing you there!
Chheau = tree
"Dipterocarpus alatus
Dipterocarpus alatus is a tropical forest tree, of dense evergreen or mixed dense forests, common in Thailand, Cambodia, Laos and Vietnam."
I go with Koh Rong Samloem by the way.
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Re: Koh Rong Samloem
I remember something similar from schoolyard days - something from the jacaranda family?Username Taken wrote:It has 'helicopters'. Great for playing
Bodge: This ain't Kansas, and the neighbours ate Toto!
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Re: Koh Rong Samloem
There's no wrong when you're trying to romanize certain letters/sounds (for example, when either p or b can be used as there is no equivalent sound in English). However, the difference between N and M is easily distinguishable in both Khmer and English. No real excuse for the mistake. Seems it's just been copy-pasted over the years.JBTrain wrote:There is no wrong in Anglicized Khmer. Look at highway signs or other government funded projects and you'll see myriad spellings for the same place. There is no official bible, it's not the BBC.OrangeDragon wrote:Tell us a little about yourself.
I've been living here 2 years, am married to a wonderful Khmer woman (who is one of the best cooks I know... western or asian food), work online for companies in the US doing software and web design with a small side business here of setting off professional firework displays, like long walks on the beach (holding Cambod's hand optional) and watching the sunset over a large glass of mojito.
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Re: Koh Rong Samloem
The 'O' on Ochheuteal means 'creek' as in a small river. Same as Otres Beach, and the road names for the road that goes from the back of the town to Otres - Omui, Opii, Obei, Obun, Obram...Username Taken wrote:Not sure about the 'O', but the chheauteal refers to the Tiel tree....Jaap N. wrote:I've been wondering about that name, 'Ochheuteal'. What does it mean?CharlieHarpersBar wrote:Mind you, I've seen many different spellings of Ochheuteal on the road signs directing you there!
Not true. There is an official (government approved) transliteration system for Khmer/English and official place names and place name spellings as issued by the Cambodian Department of Geography. Before making signs, maps, etc, the project is supposed to contact and receive approval for the spelling from the Dept of Geo. As evidenced by the variety of spellings out there, not all follow the rules. Misspellings are also sometimes due to the sign maker preferring a different spelling for some other reason, such as it being traditional, more common, etc. (e.g. the official spelling of Siem Reap is Siem Reab, but almost nobody uses it.) Still, the Dept of Geo does sometimes make a stink about official spellings and makes them change spellings on signs and such.JBTrain wrote:There is no wrong in Anglicized Khmer. Look at highway signs or other government funded projects and you'll see myriad spellings for the same place. There is no official bible, it's not the BBC.
Regarding the spelling of Koh Rong Samloem, it doesn't matter much how some random guy thinks it should be transliterated. The only transliteration that comes attached with a "should be spelled this way" is the official transliteration issued by the Cambodian Department of Geography. I can't find my most recent official map, but here is the official map from the 80s, which also happens to agree with the French nautical maps from the 50s and 60s. I'll see if I can't find my newest official map to confirm.
Last edited by LTO on Mon Jun 02, 2014 2:03 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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"Kafka is 'outdone' in our country, the new fatherland of Angkor" - Norodom Sihanouk
"Kafka is 'outdone' in our country, the new fatherland of Angkor" - Norodom Sihanouk
Re: Koh Rong Samloem
And there you have it, folks. Back to work.
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Re: Koh Rong Samloem
Interesting, I would have assumed it was the ministry of public works and transport who did that as they're the ones that print out most maps (never knew there was a Department of Geography). A lot of the older French maps have vastly different spellings than the ones used today, mainly because they were geared to French-speakers. Although they're usually pretty accurate in terms of sound, most non-Francophones would find them hard to read, so a lot of the romanization has changed over time. I wonder if the Ministry of Geography are the ones who have been talking to Google and are thus responsible for all the recent name changes.LTO wrote:[
Not true. There is an official (government approved) transliteration system for Khmer/English and official place names and place name spellings as issued by the Cambodian Department of Geography. Before making signs, maps, etc, the project is supposed to contact and receive approval for the spelling from the Dept of Geo. As evidenced by the variety of spellings out there, not all follow the rules. Misspellings are also sometimes due to the sign maker preferring a different spelling for some other reason, such as it being traditional, more common, etc. (e.g. the official spelling of Siem Reap is Siem Reab, but almost nobody uses it.) Still, the Dept of Geo does sometimes make a stink about official spellings and makes them change spellings on signs and such.
Regarding the spelling of Koh Rong Samloem, it doesn't matter much how some random guy thinks it should be transliterated. The only transliteration that comes attached with a "should be spelled this way" is the official transliteration issued by the Cambodian Department of Geography. I can't find my most recent official map, but here is the official map from the 80s, which also happens to agree with the French nautical maps from the 50s and 60s. I'll see if I can't find my newest official map to confirm.
Anyways, I'm not exactly a Khmer linguist, but I'd say that's most definitely an "n" sound:
កោះរ៉ុងសន្លឹម (the ន្លឹ wouldn't really sound like an "m" to anyone I'd think. Maybe a few people can ask their wives or something).
Anyways, it would be interesting to see a modern map to know what the most recent version of it is.
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Re: Koh Rong Samloem
I'd agree with that, but . . .Bitte_Kein_Lexus wrote:Anyways, I'm not exactly a Khmer linguist, but I'd say that's most definitely an "n" sound:
កោះរ៉ុងសន្លឹម (the ន្លឹ wouldn't really sound like an "m" to anyone I'd think. Maybe a few people can ask their wives or something).
Is it possible that there is no correct way to spell it in Khmer?
A quick glance at the top of LTO's map, it looks like there is a 'sara om / am' above the Sor - like this សំ
Unfortunately there is a wrinkle in the map at that point, so it's not quite clear. But, if that is the case, it would probably be transliterated as 'Som' or 'Sam', rather than with the 'n' sound as you say. Koh Rong Samloem.
Perhaps it's an old spelling.
Perhaps I'm wrong.
@LTO, can you iron the map a bit and re-post?
Re: Koh Rong Samloem
Too drunk to post words.Username Taken wrote:@LTO, can you iron the map a bit and re-post?
Here is the 80s map closer:
I've also got the official transliteration sheet around here somewhere...somewhere...
LTO Cambodia Blog
"Kafka is 'outdone' in our country, the new fatherland of Angkor" - Norodom Sihanouk
"Kafka is 'outdone' in our country, the new fatherland of Angkor" - Norodom Sihanouk
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