vaccination is NOT mandatory in the US for schoolkids and it is currently up to each school district/state and there are big fights going on

He did not say it was.

Kammekor wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:42 pm

violet wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 2:39 pm Hello.

You talk about a fully vaccinated population being the way out for polio - yep. A one off vaccination. When the entire population is vaccinated the disease can’t survive.

Then you talk about the flu. A flu vaccine does not stop the flu being in our environment, spread and caught. It requires regular jabs each year. Many never have a flu jab. I have only ever had two in my life for example.

It makes sense to make something like the polio vaccine mandatory. Or Yellow Fever for entry to some countries. But general consensus is that covid-19, like the flu, will never be eliminated. So, it isn’t logical to compare it to mandatory vaccines that enable a disease to be eliminated from a population.

It ought to be compared to a flu jab. Covid-19 would still exist spread and be caught even if we were 100% vaccinated worldwide, because the vaccines are not made to eliminate the virus, their design means they reduce rather than eliminate. Those who are vulnerable, and who choose to, have the flu jab. Those who are vulnerable, and who choose to, should have the covid jab.

It’s not logical to mandate the vaccines when they reduce rather than eliminate. If they produce a vaccine that eliminates, I’d say mandate it immediately worldwide.

Looks like a reasoning designed for Covid which doesn't hold in the real word.

How about Hepatitis B or TB vaccines? Those vaccines do not offer a 100% protection, but the chances of contracting the disease decrease immensely after a vaccination. Some people need boosters for Hepatitis too.
In the Western world these vaccines with an efficacy of 70-100% have worked out to a near-elimination, and I am sure 99% of the people discussing vaccines here have had several hepatitis jabs without a 100% guarantee, and the smart ones residing in Cambodia had their TB shots as well i hope.

If these vaccines would have been treated as the covid vaccine with only 60-70% being vaccinated I am sure the near elimination would not have happened.

Fair point there. But hep vaccines and tb vaccines aren’t mandatory. Why a need to make covid vaccines mandatory? The very push to do so gets the backs up of many who might otherwise have chosen to get it. Regardless of if that is selfishness, it’s a human reaction.

phuketrichard wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:48 pm

hanno wrote: ↑Tue Sep 14, 2021 2:27 pm Many vaccinations are already mandatory when travelling to certain regions: schoolkids in the US must get vaccinated, many countries require yellow fever shots.

Vaccination is NOT mandatory in the US for schoolkids and it is currently up to each school district/state and there are big fights going on

FYI:
i've never had a flu shot an haven't had any vaccines since 1980
am still here and have not been hospitalized for an infections ever

so the argument that hospitals shouldn't treat ur for covid if ur not vaccinated? fuck>>>

so turn away
aids patients
drunks
drug addicts
as well?

slippery slope ur heading towards

https://www.ncsl.org/research/health/sc ... -laws.aspx

I am not sure what is involved with mandatory so, if it means mandatory across the board, regardless, obviously against putting people with adverse reactions at risk.

If it means mandatory, with those exceptions, I'm still against it.

I am, however, for mandatory with medical exceptions, and anyone else who can successfully submit a plausible excuse why they feel they have the right to possibly kill another human being.

Pseudonomdeplume wrote: ↑Wed Sep 15, 2021 12:23 am I am not sure what is involved with mandatory so, if it means mandatory across the board, regardless, obviously against putting people with adverse reactions at risk.

If it means mandatory, with those exceptions, I'm still against it.

I am, however, for mandatory with medical exceptions, and anyone else who can successfully submit a plausible excuse why they feel they have the right to possibly kill another human being.

Do you drive a car you could possibly have an accident and kill another human being
Do you smoke you could possibly kill another human being
Do you have sex you could possibly spread an STD
Etc etc etc

My personal opinion is that everyone should get vaccinated for Covid, if possible. I don't like the idea of being vaccinated by force, but who does ? Mostly, I think that some people, such as health care workers, SHOULD be obliged to be vaccinated because of their job.

If you really don't want to be convinced about the importance of getting of getting a Covid vaccine, then this article won't convince you. However, this is worth a read and reflection for those who think that getting Covid is no big deal.

‘The virus is painfully real’: vaccine hesitant people are dying – and their loved ones want the world to listen
In the UK, the majority of those now in hospital with Covid-19 are unvaccinated. Many face their last days with enormous regret, and their relatives are telling their stories to try to convince others like them

Sirin Kale
Tue 14 Sep 2021 06.00 BST

Matt Wynter, a 42-year-old music agent from Leek, Staffordshire, was working out in his local gym in mid-August when he saw, to his great surprise, that his best friend, Marcus Birks, was on the television. He jumped off the elliptical trainer and listened carefully.

The first thing he noticed was that Birks, who was also from Leek and a performer with the dance group Cappella, looked terrible. He was gasping for breath and his face was pale. “Marcus would never usually have gone on TV without having done his hair and had a shave,” Wynter says.

Breathing heavily from his intensive care unit bed at Royal Stoke university hospital, Birks told the BBC interviewer that he had been wrong about Covid-19. “If you haven’t been ill,” he said, “you don’t think you’re going to get ill, so you listen to the [anti-vaccine] stuff.” He spoke of his regret at not being vaccinated. “First thing I am going [to] tell all my family to do is get the vaccine and [then] anybody I see,” he said. “And as soon as I can get it, I am definitely getting it.”

Birks had rejected the vaccine because he thought it had been rushed through. “He thought it was an emergency vaccine,” says Wynter, “and he wanted to wait it out a little bit, before taking it.” Birks was the sort of person who was always “very anti putting anything in his body at all”, Wynter says. He wouldn’t drink or touch drugs – he wouldn’t even take paracetamol for a headache. And besides, Birks was a fitness enthusiast, going to the gym five times a week, so he figured that if he got Covid, he would most likely be fine.

Watching his interview, Wynter had never been so proud of his best friend. “It takes a lot of balls to stand up there and admit that maybe you made the wrong decision and had the wrong views,” he said. He texted Birks straight away. “I’m really proud of you mate, you’re a hero.” Birks responded from his hospital bed: “Thanks man, that was mad.”

Birks never got a chance to get out of hospital and get vaccinated. He died on 27 August, aged 40. He left behind his wife and musical partner, Lis, who is pregnant with their first child. (Wynter is speaking with Lis’s blessing.) “I have never experienced grief like it,” says Wynter.

In the UK and other developed nations such as France and the US, Covid-19 has become a pandemic of the unvaccinated. Last month, Prof Chris Whitty, England’s chief medical officer, tweeted that: “The majority of our hospitalised Covid patients are unvaccinated and regret delaying [their vaccines].” About 60% of all hospitalisations due to Covid in the UK are of unvaccinated people. An Office for National Statistics report published on Monday says that in the first six months of 2021, Covid was involved in 37.4% of deaths in unvaccinated people – and just 0.8% of deaths in fully vaccinated people.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/ ... -to-listen

John Bingham wrote: ↑Wed Sep 15, 2021 12:46 am People who don't get vaccinated should be allowed to die naturally. It's their choice and we should respect it.

Don't be so kind hearted. Thats too good for them - forcible vaccination. Hold them down and stick it up them. All this talk about 'rights'. Human rights were invented by Thomas Paine, an Irishman, around 200 years ago. Up till then people did what they were told - and liked it.

I have just been reading about Denmark lifting all Covid restrictions - why? Because 84% of the population is fully vaccinated. Also new anti-viral treatments are being developed to improve medical care for patients with the virus. New Zealand is also on track for this by December. OK they both have small populations (around 5 million) and a reasonably compliant society. But where would you rather live - Copenhagen, Auckland, or Birmingham?