Learning Khmer (Basic)
- Freightdog
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Re: Learning Khmer (Basic)
One thing that I feel I would do very differently is get into writing and reading Khmer much sooner.
For me-
-It helps put into perspective the ‘romanised’ versions of Khmer, and does away with romanising as a crutch*
-the old technique of reading signs, shop notices, and defining the words helps to put things into context.
-I want to be able to read documents, menus and letters as much as I want to be able to talk to family.
*
Bottle ដប Dab
Ten ដប់ Dab,
So similar, but importantly and subtly different, and ends up in so much debate as people try to reconcile the different character sounds with a romanised version. It’s somewhat more akin to dropping the letter T in English words. I believe I would have made more progress sooner, had I put a bit more into understanding the Khmer alphabet. And I’m glacial when it comes to learning languages.
Even now, I’m trying to get my head and ear around certain sounds, such as ង, which is sounded very differently (for my very limited appreciation of the language) when saying the character sound compared to when using it in a word.
For me-
-It helps put into perspective the ‘romanised’ versions of Khmer, and does away with romanising as a crutch*
-the old technique of reading signs, shop notices, and defining the words helps to put things into context.
-I want to be able to read documents, menus and letters as much as I want to be able to talk to family.
*
Bottle ដប Dab
Ten ដប់ Dab,
So similar, but importantly and subtly different, and ends up in so much debate as people try to reconcile the different character sounds with a romanised version. It’s somewhat more akin to dropping the letter T in English words. I believe I would have made more progress sooner, had I put a bit more into understanding the Khmer alphabet. And I’m glacial when it comes to learning languages.
Even now, I’m trying to get my head and ear around certain sounds, such as ង, which is sounded very differently (for my very limited appreciation of the language) when saying the character sound compared to when using it in a word.
Re: Learning Khmer (Basic)
Devil is always in the detail. Compare to:
ten
teen
In English. Similar writing, different meaning & pronunciation.
Re: Learning Khmer (Basic)
Perhaps knowing the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA) helps as the spelling doesn't really reflect how a word sound.
By using dictionary.tovnah.com, I learnt that the pronunciation of ដប 'bottle' is /dɑɑp/, but instead of /ɑɑ/, I could just write /ɑː/, so /dɑːp/.
You probably know how the consonants /d/ and /p/ sound, but not the vowel /ɑ/. I'd try to produce this sound by starting with what English speakers already have.
By using an English dictionary, I learnt that the word 'arm' is pronounced as /ɑːm/ in British English. So ដប is pronounced as,
/ɑːm/ → /dɑːm/ → /dɑːp/
As for the word ដប់ 'ten', "a diacritical mark (់) placed over a final consonant of a syllable to indicate that the preceding vowel is shortened". So ដប់ is pronounced as,
/ɑːm/ → /dɑːm/ → /dɑːp/ → /dɑp/
The IPA spellings for 'ten' and 'teen' are /ten/ and /ˈtiːn/ respectively.
By using dictionary.tovnah.com, I learnt that the pronunciation of ដប 'bottle' is /dɑɑp/, but instead of /ɑɑ/, I could just write /ɑː/, so /dɑːp/.
You probably know how the consonants /d/ and /p/ sound, but not the vowel /ɑ/. I'd try to produce this sound by starting with what English speakers already have.
By using an English dictionary, I learnt that the word 'arm' is pronounced as /ɑːm/ in British English. So ដប is pronounced as,
/ɑːm/ → /dɑːm/ → /dɑːp/
As for the word ដប់ 'ten', "a diacritical mark (់) placed over a final consonant of a syllable to indicate that the preceding vowel is shortened". So ដប់ is pronounced as,
/ɑːm/ → /dɑːm/ → /dɑːp/ → /dɑp/
The IPA spellings for 'ten' and 'teen' are /ten/ and /ˈtiːn/ respectively.
My post 2021-01-30 14:33 ICT disappeared for no reason.
- Bitte_Kein_Lexus
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Re: Learning Khmer (Basic)
I did the same as you, the same year as you did (!). Well, I actually went to a translation agency that also ran a Khmer school. They had a full curriculum and all that, it was pretty good. I think I was paying $5/hour back then for one on one, which was a bit pricey but I didn't mind it. It really expedited my Khmer and though I got really lazy once I could get by, I'm happy I studied for the few months I did. I think anyone who knows they're coming here for a year or more (unless you're some super busy CEO or something) should make it a priority to learn Khmer with a tutor the first few months they're here. It really makes everything easier/better and opens up a gamut of possible cultural experiences/knowledge.Kammekor wrote:When I came to Cambodia in 2009 I went to the nearest highschool and asked the director if I could talk to some of his English teachers. I asked them if they were willing to teach me Khmer, picked one, and studied one hour a day for a about one and a half years. I paid 2$ per hour if I remember correctly, but 2009 was a different era. At least it feels like a different era.
I am not fluent now, far from, but my Khmer is more than enough to manage daily life by myself.
For me, face to face learning is much more efficient than online.
Ex Bitteeinbit/LexusSchmexus
- pissontheroof
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Re: Learning Khmer (Basic)
nerdlinger wrote: ↑Sun Aug 29, 2021 4:40 pmYou should tell them that. Please film it and post the outcome here.pissontheroof wrote: ↑Sun Aug 29, 2021 8:15 am
I think it’s a weird language and they should change it all together or just switch and speak thai here
filming sound s like something a nerd would do ..
I have run acrost some who worked in thailand that i can talk to a little bit
พิซออนเดอรูฟ
Re: Learning Khmer (Basic)
I was lucky enough to get a few weeks of language training by my employer before starting work in 2009, so I knew some basic words / sentences before starting off.Bitte_Kein_Lexus wrote: ↑Mon Aug 30, 2021 8:40 am I did the same as you, the same year as you did (!). Well, I actually went to a translation agency that also ran a Khmer school. They had a full curriculum and all that, it was pretty good. I think I was paying $5/hour back then for one on one, which was a bit pricey but I didn't mind it. It really expedited my Khmer and though I got really lazy once I could get by, I'm happy I studied for the few months I did. I think anyone who knows they're coming here for a year or more (unless you're some super busy CEO or something) should make it a priority to learn Khmer with a tutor the first few months they're here. It really makes everything easier/better and opens up a gamut of possible cultural experiences/knowledge.
I agree with the effort of learning the language when you're planning to stay beyond a few months. In a former life I've been a teacher and I always was annoyed when parents would show up on parent's night unable to understand a word I said, bringing their kids to translate, while having been in the country for over two decades.
Being able to speak Khmer makes life a lot easier in Cambodia, plus a lot more interesting because you're able to leave the bubble of Westerners.
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Re: Learning Khmer (Basic)
I’m relatively new to Cambodian, but in a past life I lived in Japan and can always tell who learned the Japanese alphabet early doors and which ones relied on romanisation. Especially if they’re from a certain country I won’t name but who do seem to enjoy adding extra diphthongs to words…Freightdog wrote: ↑Sun Aug 29, 2021 7:40 pm -It helps put into perspective the ‘romanised’ versions of Khmer, and does away with romanising as a crutch*
Re: Learning Khmer (Basic)
My advice for Youtube is "Khmer Lesson": https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCPC5C- ... pvWi03Zr1A . It provides lots of nuances on why to choose one word over another etc, and it also works well to just ignore the video and listen to the audio. It focuses on the informal rather than the formal which is always good if the goal is to be able to have a normal conversation in Cambodia. I've used this as an audio resource listening to it while walking/taking transportation etc. For this Youtube premium subscription is great because it unlocks offline-videos and no ads.
Another resource I really like is the Audible audio book "Learn Khmer for beginners!": https://www.audible.co.uk/pd/Learn-Khme ... 6HBBRX73CK It has tons of English-Khmer content and the pronunciation is ultra-clear, so much so that even after studying khmer on and off for a couple of years I discovered that I've pronounced many words wrong all along.
For memorizing words I prefer Anki on Windows. In my experience it's the most efficient way of memorizing words because of the algorithm that does a pretty good job at deciding when you need to focus on which words. I haven't tried the app version since it's pretty expensive and I actually prefer to use a computer when I'm 100% focused in studying mode.
Good luck!
Another resource I really like is the Audible audio book "Learn Khmer for beginners!": https://www.audible.co.uk/pd/Learn-Khme ... 6HBBRX73CK It has tons of English-Khmer content and the pronunciation is ultra-clear, so much so that even after studying khmer on and off for a couple of years I discovered that I've pronounced many words wrong all along.
For memorizing words I prefer Anki on Windows. In my experience it's the most efficient way of memorizing words because of the algorithm that does a pretty good job at deciding when you need to focus on which words. I haven't tried the app version since it's pretty expensive and I actually prefer to use a computer when I'm 100% focused in studying mode.
Good luck!
- Freightdog
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Re: Learning Khmer (Basic)
Shameless thread resurrection- I’d apologise, but I’d be lying!
Are there any recent experiences with getting a Khmer tutor, for 1-1 casual sessions, that might be recommended?
I’ve made some enquiries with a few schools, both active teachers at regular schools, and a few aimed at resident Barangs, with next to nil success.
Reading/writing initially, and then comprehension.
Are there any recent experiences with getting a Khmer tutor, for 1-1 casual sessions, that might be recommended?
I’ve made some enquiries with a few schools, both active teachers at regular schools, and a few aimed at resident Barangs, with next to nil success.
Reading/writing initially, and then comprehension.
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