miciur wrote: ↑Wed Aug 21, 2019 8:44 am

AndyKK wrote: ↑Tue Aug 20, 2019 7:47 pm Pali language firstly tell me who and how it was translated to Khmer language, you quote 85% don't understand English. Is that only an estimated guess, I too would guess near the same amount don't read or write Khmer. But that is the concept; that soon they will be learnt, because of their ongoing disciplined schooling. That is also were the Buddhist Society premotes the western monk due to his translation and teaching skills.
Why do you not understand the young novice. He will play, it the life's part of growing up. All kid's play and also learn, and many learnings come from earlier play. But the Wats need the young schoolers to carry on the work of a monk. You said yourself some only wear the robe. I would say they are the one's to use it for the wrong reason. Another thing you maybe able to clarify to this subject. Are some adolescent men sent to the pagoda for crimes they had previously committed?

I don’t know who and how translated because I never care, but if you want know I’ll ask for you. Yes I estimated it is approx real. You said monks 85% illiterate, it is bullshit. Every monk can read and write by khmer except few new kids ( novice). I understand young novices I don’t understand why they can become to monkhood under 14 years old. Wats need kids because dramatically reduced number of Cambodian men who want to be monk. Now can find novices just in poor rural areas. I don’t want clarify this subject, have no any secret. Supervisors of former monk didn’t see or didn’t want see his bad habit. I don’t know how deep you know Cambodian monkhood. It is a closed company, I’m in but I I also don’t know every small details.

But that is what I am refering too! You say the young monk's don't know how to read or write. But they will do because they are going to be schooled with the teaching. I don't know why all youngsters are there I suppose that their are many reasons. I only know of a few that their parents placed them knowing that they will have education. Also they are donating toward this and the children's welfare at the temple.
You say you are in? What nationality are you?

AndyKK wrote: ↑Tue Aug 20, 2019 7:47 pm
But that is what I am refering too! You say the young monk's don't know how to read or write. But they will do because they are going to be schooled with the teaching. I don't know why all youngsters are there I suppose that their are many reasons. I only know of a few that their parents placed them knowing that they will have education. Also they are donating toward this and the children's welfare at the temple.
You say you are in? What nationality are you?

Few young can’t read and write! Main reason parents want they’s son will be monk. Another reason a basic education. For higher education or study English monks also need pay!!
Anyway wats support many university students with accommodation and a bit food ( lunch).
I’m Hungarian.

miciur nice too write with you about the subject It helps to know somthing more of the subject matter.
Like I said back in the beginning, from reading a old post of a guy who seemed to be looking for a place in this country, it got me thinking about was it a likely possibility. Someone I think refers to him in that thread about a western monk in Phnom Penh. I myself have not seen any westen monks in this country, or at least not in the places I have visited over the years. The only place in Asia where I have seen them is in Thailand. Being a western monk it that country you would be expected to pay for the pleasures of doing so. But on the other hand that maybe because the Thais themselves more then likely do the same, not the one's who are serious about joining for the long time. But all are expected to go and stay at a temple at least once in their lifetime. That goes for women has Nuns too. I have known quite a few go and stay at the temple for three day's or a week. Some Thais do this at times for days, weeks, month's or years. Most if not all will donate for the privilege. Same with western people coming for the same reasons, would it be karma, meditation or peaceful relaxation. The one's whom seem to participate more maybe seen to have stressful job's in the west. Paying good money too for the service. There are a few retreats here too that you will be aware of. I saw the same kind of thing nearly 30 years ago with the indu, Jain ashrams scattered wide and far in India. All participents paid for the service, or by the better wording, made donations of expectance, or too what was possibly affordable on agreement. Although at those time's the places were already resembling, to what bussiness they have certainly become of today.
That is where I had first encounterd Buddhism firstly in the high Indian hills. We, myself and my nefuew were just on a track lined with Rodeden in full bloom the scent of the flowers were so pungent in the cool air, light snowfall still upon the ground at least in the shaded areas. It was so nice to leave behind, the dust and heat from lower down a week ago, more so the confusion of busy overcrowded city's. It was a world apart and so very peaceful on approaching the temple before us, with the many colourful preyer flags flaping around in the light breeze. To the rightside the ground was a little rugged, also now the cloud formations seemed lower, that being due to the valley over just a little way.
We followed the rocky outcrop because the grassy path on the left was too boggy with the snow melt, and less steep so used hard like now with one guy and his two loaded yak, we sat for a while and looked at these beasts. I had never seen them in real life. Packhorse are used too, being the only way to get goods up and down here. Some of the rock steps we're getting harder with my heavy loaded backpack, then the little steep climb started to ease at the slop, with the temple below its brow. Where we both took deep breaths in rhythm between us like their was no air left where we were "possibly wondering if once again this was a good idea". Then their was loud voices and laughter, a little commotion has young child monks 'novices' came running out of the temple taunting the slightly older tall boy infront of them, has if he was being chased by a mob, the taller boy bent down and picked up a sizable stone. Sudden stop and silance from the one's taurnting, then with anger and so much force he throw the stone at the tree that had grown so strong over many year's. The boy then ran and ran down the hillside toward the valley, the group of youngsters now creased up in tears of happy childness laughs and giggles.
We was to drink tea with the older monk's has we were to rest a awhile, the monks bidding us welcome and speaking English. It was the older boy whom kept getting something wrong with is teachings, not unlike the Pali language or some tought script, but he was just begun to learn as had the younger boy's but a few years earlier.
We actually stayed nearby. Well up the mountainside, we rented a room in a old house. It took a good half day down to the village for food and back up again. We visited the temple once more and the new monk whom was taunted was learning and giving daily water to that old tree he stuck with the stone. Later on the trek, it was not just the yaks and horse that carried goods! A few oldies passed us at some pace, but carrying 10 foot by 1 foot square on their backs with the weight taken by a strap on their forehead.

AndyKK your story is so nice. My opinion western monks maybe can visit here some wats, but I don’t think they can live and teach in Cambodia. Few country have ordained nuns also. Cambodian Buddhist authority doesn’t allow this. Where you live? Phnom Penh? What is your nationality?

newkidontheblock wrote: ↑Tue Aug 20, 2019 3:33 am I never expect a loan to a Khmer to ever be repaid.

That being said, missus handles all the requests.

Right now she is in hot water with her sister in law for loaning money to her older brother so he can expand his business.

The wife is unhappy the he didn’t discuss it with her and went straight to missus for help.

Even the best of intentions backfire in the KOW.

The poster above you, newkidontheblock has very wise words, 'Neither a borrower nor a lender be'. Both ways would keep you out of trouble, why would you "never expect a loan to a Khmer to ever be repaid". Is there a reason for you to believe this? I can see the reasoning of your sister in law being unhappy, although he did approach his sister for the loan, you would possibly feel the same if your wife did likewise.
I agree with the poster about borrowing or lending, it's certainly better if not doing either. But if you did loan, are there conditions, such as payments due back in instalments, final payment date, or even charge agreed interest rate. To be honest most of us have lent or borrowed at some times in our lives, I can't see the difference who you lend too, it's only a problem if the borrower has no means to pay back the loan. I have lent in the past and had been paid back, and sometimes not. Money, they say is the root of all evil. But I have lent monies too Khmer's and westerners over the years, and mostly been paid back. It's the nature of the game, with family and close friends it's more pot luck, best if your never sure, is to refrain from lending, and tell them there are professional's such has Banks that do this sort of thing. But there is the problem for many who want to borrow, they don’t fit the recommendations of what the bank need of them, again if the bank won’t lend the money are you sure you should.
Like I have said it’s if the person who borrows can pay back the amount, or more to the point, will pay back. I have lent to a Khmer family on a few occasions with, you could say business loans, that is it was for their purpose of business, they paid me back every month, and on time. I have also been asked if “you like” for urgent loans, that someone needed to pay a urgent bill of say $500 because they have miss calculated the pay day, two days later I have been paid back with a little interest from their good will. Then again, a fellow countryman asked me for $100 due to it was weekend and he forgot on Friday to go to the bank, telling me Monday morning it would be repaid! Thing is he never said what Monday, so over a year later he gave me the loan back.
I have a friend here who took a huge risk a number of years ago. It was a very large gamble that not many would consider. In lending over half of his life savings to a Khmer who wanted to setup a business for the first time, he did know the family for some time, being that he was doing some private tutoring in English/Chinese language. The Khmer borrowed $80,000 saying he would pay him back monthly over a period of one year, and pay interest to him of $2000 per month also, these were the terms put forward of the Khmer lender. He did lend him the money knowing if he failed/faltered on repayments, he was himself in deep trouble with no legal means of recouping the loss of his money, with also having nothing to go back too, if he was to return to his own country. Has it happened he was paid like arranged, the full lone and interest, but not only that! The Khmer has himself built up a few good businesses, from the initial lone those years ago, my friend who lent the lone had just excepted a new Honda Dream from the lender (this was his wife's idea) now the lender said we will pay you $1500 per month for this year, instead of the $2000, the lender kept on paying him monthly, for what he had done for him, with the lending of the lone to make it at all possible.
It makes one think about getting involved when you look again at the headline of the post, I mean the person who is dead had helped this so-called monk out when needed. Like too it was previously mentioned what trouble it can bring, being kind and helpful for a friend in need, one friend not long ago was having her body parts thawed out down riverside.

Doc67 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 17, 2019 12:23 pm 'Neither a borrower nor a lender be'

It seems both are equally dangerous in this country.

I read a book a long while back called Money #1. It contained the words, along the lines of, "don't ever tell your wife that you are worth more dead than alive because, in Thailand, dead can be arranged" Chilling advice.

How do people in serious relationships with Khmers deal with loan requests from family members? They must be fraught with risks of future relationships being soured due to default.

Yes! Could agree and relate to your quote, for some, but again not all. I hear poisoning is apparently high on the list here.

miciur wrote: ↑Thu Aug 22, 2019 5:32 pm AndyKK your story is so nice. My opinion western monks maybe can visit here some wats, but I don’t think they can live and teach in Cambodia. Few country have ordained nuns also. Cambodian Buddhist authority doesn’t allow this. Where you live? Phnom Penh? What is your nationality?

Miciur, sorry for the delay in getting back to your question. I am British, and yes, for now I am residing in Phnom Penh, it’s actually the 6th longer-term accommodations for me, and there may possibly be more.
The story I am happy that you thought it nice, true also. You spoke of knowing so many 100s of monks yourself here in Cambodia, and writing western monks and Nuns not accepted. Is it that they are not accepted by the Khmer monks or the people? Cambodian Buddhist authority please can you talk more about this please?
Here I have listed a few articles of interesting reading

Brother Mark an ordained monk of 15 years, living in Phnom Penh at the time 3.5 years.
With his olive skin, red robes, bald head and skinny frame, the Venerable Vira Avalokita looks like an ordinary monk at first glance. But his round, light blue eyes betray his American roots. Born James Beard to a protestant family in the Northwest, Avalokita was ordained in 1987 in the Koyasan Shingon Japanese Buddhist tradition. Upon arriving in Cambodia in 1997, he devoted his time to Phnom Penh’s Municipal Referral Hospital, where he helped establish an HIV/AIDS clinic. In the early 1990s he published several books at the University of Washington, and is currently working on a book about Buddhism and behavioral psychology. Bennett Murray talked to the American monk about his life in Cambodia and his relationship with Cambodia’s Theravada Buddhist Community..



Monk receives Golden Pagoda Award
Venerable Preah Tepsattha Khy Sovanratana, vice rector at Preah Sihanouk Raja Buddhist University, on Tuesday received the Golden Pagoda award from Thailand’s King Maha Vajiranlongkorn, recognising his contributions to the Buddhism religion.

https://www.khmertimeskh.com/625477/mon ... oda-award/

I see there was an Australian monk in Siam Reap 2018.

post260406.html?hilit=can%20one%20be%20 ... ia#p260406

Coming of age with Cambodia’s young Buddhist monks
After becoming friendly with a group of monks, US photographer Enoch Contreras ended up staying with them and following their daily routine – discovering a welcoming community that shattered his preconceptions.

https://www.huckmag.com/art-and-culture ... ist-monks/

The Sisterhood
Off a road about 3 km north of Phnom Penh International Airport, past clothing and food stalls, where the cracked pavement turns to dirt flanked by grazing cows and duck ponds, the temple stands modestly, absent the ornate stupas that adorn most of the country’s pagodas.

https://www.cambodiadaily.com/features/ ... od-106083/

Miciur Quote -
Have two different group, one who are monks, two who are just wearing robe!
You had also asked me the following –
“I don’t know how deep you know Cambodian monkhood. It is a closed company”, I’m in but I I also don’t know every small details.
In Cambodia I have drove, we will call, the Abbott and his monks around on many occasions in past years, mostly in the North of the country, and its problematic borders, mostly I would be taking them to the barracks when visiting Army generals. With the monks attaching their flags on the wing mirrors, it was nice to see and have help from the courteous police.
If there was a gathering at certain Wats, I would be placed with an armed person (ununiformed) for protection.
I don’t know if you have ever come across military in full combat gear, being at least 4-6 in the treeline with very up to date equipment. Even so, with what I have experienced. I still would not word the monkhood like you think of it, thou like I said it is very Khmer in more ways. And I too don’t know every small detail. A question I asked you “are some monks sent there for possible crimes”?
As for the small details, you need to decide for yourself.

AndyKK wrote
Cambodia, and writing western monks and Nuns not accepted. Is it that they are not accepted by the Khmer monks or the people? Cambodian Buddhist authority please can you talk more about this please?

I think Cambodia Buddhist Authority will not accept. In hehe have no chance for ordain! I sent a PM to you.

miciur wrote: ↑Tue Aug 27, 2019 1:08 pm AndyKK wrote
Cambodia, and writing western monks and Nuns not accepted. Is it that they are not accepted by the Khmer monks or the people? Cambodian Buddhist authority please can you talk more about this please?

I think Cambodia Buddhist Authority will not accept. In hehe have no chance for ordain! I sent a PM to you.

It is a conclusion of what I expected, this is a unwritten rule from the powers of the rulers of what will be, nothing to do with the ways of a Buddhist follower but how such, can be said that they will adhere too.