flying chicken wrote:Did I hear a free beer? I'll be there.

StroppyChops wrote:

General Mackevili wrote:

StroppyChops wrote: - no religious strings, no Christian overtures, nada. Just free education to those that can't afford it.

WooHoo! I was hoping this would come out!

Testify, brother General!

flying chicken wrote:Let me help you to get your fact straight. We are Thailand's refugee and I was fortunate enough to get raise in New Zealand.

dagenham wrote:

flying chicken wrote:Let me help you to get your fact straight. We are Thailand's refugee and I was fortunate enough to get raise in New Zealand.

OK...got it...Thai-Chinese then and "lucky you" getting to NZ - indeed...I must say that your posts are like they're being shot out of a shotgun...filled with air bubbles...

dagenham wrote:DAGENHAM'S RELIGIOUS MANIFESTO (DRAFT)

-- dagenham on what's in the Bible

If there is "sin" (a big "if" for me as an agnostic) I can't believe they are all considered the "same degree". Plus, angels and sprites and ghosts and pixies didn't write the bible - men did - by committee to be exact. Divinity? Really? Whatever...and the bible clearly states that all the non-believers in the bloke with the cool beard - Senor JC - are going to burn in hell when the 4 horsemen descend. That includes generous Jews, pious Muslims, Compassionate Buddhists - are to the barbeque with the fellow with the horns and tail...great story and total fear-based propaganda bullshit... No Humanistic spin can be put on the non-negotiable crystal-clear stance in the bible, written repeatedly, that non-believers in JC are destined for the fire heap due South of here. Period. Double Period. There aint no sugar-coating that core tenet of Christianity - it is absolutely intolerant of any other belief systems. Period. Double Period. There simply is no softening of that overt and mortal threat to scores of "good people" who don't happen to buy that singular inflexible menu on offer in the bible...whilst the heavens open for the sweet-souled believers, simultaneously the ground drops out for the hapless rest of the world - adios amigos.

How can the bible be considered the "scared" Word-of-God if penned by mere mortals who use the loo? Poetic parables and social politics at best...

The bible's true provenance is slippery and hazy from any angle. I understand the origins of the bible and the fact that is was written by man (men) negates the entire premise that it is "the word of god". If it is indeed straight from the lips of god then what mortal made that absolute judgement?

there is no threat leveled at non-believers or Gentiles in the entire Jewish scriptures as there clearly is in the Christian bible. That is an undisputed fact amongst scholars and theologians...

There's only one way up to heaven and only one way down to hell.

I can't quote the exact verses as a bible is not handy right now. I am certain that they are there because I've read them...

Again, I've read the passages. I shall find them.

Here's one, Stroppy...and there are many many more... Revelation 21:8... Directly from your "good book" and that it why you're here culturally polluting the Kingdom.

-- dagenham on Christianity and its missionaries

Of course, as we all know there have never been Christian missionaries actively trying to convert natives and destroy indigenous societies all over the globe throughout the history of the planet. Hmmm...

I actively choose to disbelieve and distrust those (religions) that have the most flagrant and offensive threats toward any "others" - like Christianity and Islam for example.

I feel much more affinity and acceptance toward (Jews, Buddhits and Animists) than the criminal Missionary crews running amok (bad pun I know) here and everywhere else on the planet. Ban, tar, feather and deport them all I say!

A hater of missionaries (of any faith) I am.

What I'm most interested in the inherent Christian "threat" as I have spoken about at length about.

So...still dodging the silver bullets I see...it's OK - Christians are well, Christians...it's all about "faith", Brother and on and on and on...

What gives you the right to try to "convert" other people to your faith? It's pure arrogance and highly disrespectful to other people.

Missionaries have brought misery, suffering and death for decades to "non-believers".

I personally think that missionary work (by any religious belief system/cult) should be outlawed and I aint alone in that...Brother. There are many other people who despise and resent missionaries with the zeal and focus of myself.

there's no evil friggin' missionaries in Los Angeles, Paris or London. Why is that? Because you arrogant fucks can't manipulate the people there (they have similar capabilities to yours for resisting your trinkets and deceptions - when you knock on their doors they tell you to go away - pronto!). So you drift to 3rd-world countries to do your "work". and destroy native belief systems in the process. The same story is being played out all over the poorest regions on the globe.

All you missionaries should be herded onto some island and isolated from the rest of the planet. You're the scum of the earth...and, of course, I am a local rep for the devil himself...

You're still a sub-species that should be wiped out...nice or not...

Google missionaries and destruction and learn some important history...we're talking major social damage...self-righteous cunts all...

As I said, scores of other people, while tolerant of many belief systems, are extremely intolerant of arrogant prothelythizing missionaries - like yourself.

Do you realize what he and his crew are doing here? They're fucking with the natives' belief systems with their truckload of resources and superior educations. And that's OK? Live and let live? Not.

These missionary fucks are one baby step up from child molesters and close in level of evil to the corrupt upper classes/bureaucrats in their blatant criminality. Scum. Pure self-righteous scum.

better to consume your own sperm than prey on the defenseless like the missionaries do here...

Read the posts more carefully. I am not "against" Christianity or any other belief system (although I do think that they are all elaborate stories for the insecure).

I am stridently "against" missionaries of any stripe. There is no "belief" required from a naysayer or critic as what they do is patently wrong. Again I am not alone in this feeling and I think that probably the majority of non-believers are also against missionary "work".

Legit question, G-mack. What I really want to do is inform those who don't really understand what missionaries are doing here. I can't force them to leave or influence legislation or canvas the city with leaflets telling the populace about this plague.

Of course, that is precisely why they're here largely unopposed (and countries like this one) and not in the developed Western/Asian societies pedaling their wares. Here they have the immense power of resources and also there is basically no law or obviously enforcement if there is one either. Some countries have tried to regulate and/or restrict the missionaries from disturbing the indigenous people and their native customs, etc.

And Stroppy (and his cohort/defenders who are all Christians of course) are actively working to "save souls" through any means possible. Why? Because it is the most urgent and highest value goal as outlined repeatedly in the bible. Convert! Convert! Convert!

All the rest is smoke screen deflecting denial...never trust what any missionary "says" becasue their singular goal will trump all other concerns. Period.

Tim, the problem here is all the missionaries say the same exact thing. They say they never proselytize precisely because they know all too well that most people disapprove of that activity.

Yo! Says it all there, mate. And your friend too says that he isn't proselytizing? He's a liar, liar - pants on fire! They all lie - lying to get God's work done aint a sin...apparently...

Again, no surprise there...missionaries are programmed to lie. Get them converted first - sort out the rest later.

-- dagenham's thoughts on StroppyChops

You and your ilk are a blight on this country and countless others.

Who the fuck do you think you are? That you feel you have a superior message to "save the hapless souls" of the poor Cambodians - who are on an unequal footing when confronted by you because of lack of education and resources to match yours?

It's not a fair game that you are playing

The rub of it all is that you're probably a nice bloke. You're just so deluded that you have the right to do what you do. The Nazis were like that as well...and some of them were also decent blokes - they treated their dogs well, etc.

Go home, you twat!

More urgent question is that do you realize that you are acting highly inappropriately in a country that doesn't need your brand of "saving"?

You're widely despised for the "work" that you are doing, but you don't care - souls need to be saved at all costs.

Fuck you and your cause!

Hey, Stroppy is playing the passive/aggressive strategy - I can appreciate that. Me? I outright hate people like him - or to be more exact what people like him do in 3rd world countries.

Stroppy obviously plays the "Regular Joe" pose to disarm the critics and skeptics. And he probably is, as I said earlier, a nice bloke to meet in a bar, a restaurant, etc. Also, when preying on the poor the "nice guy" approach is most effective.

This is the classic passive/aggressive posture. (StroppyChops) is a "faithful" deluded imposter on a, self-defined, "mission" to convert lost souls. He is not really a "nice guy" at all and is doing harm to others in this country under the banner of "I have the only true religion".

Says the missionary whose only (true - not camouflaged) goal is to convert non-believers. The Great Pretender Stroppy! Disgusting...

Stroppy is the worst kind - arrogant, self-righteous under a facade of "Good 'Ol Boy" veneer. No wonder he has anger issues and they might be the primary source of his insecurity. Hence, his compulsion to exercise power "from God" to convert the natives.

Says the "Closet Christian", mate of Stroppy...you're as transparent as the local beer, Brother...

The "good guy" passive role yet again...old pose, Brother. Reread the posts - there are a number of other posters who agree with my arguments and then, of course, the "flock" of other Christians rising to defend your stance.

You never actually address any direct questions about "missionary work" - that's your dominate strategy...again, in person, you're probably a "nice guy" and that's your affect/style in converting others. That doesn't make it right.

And, yes, I hate what you are doing - not necessarily you as a person. You've been hoodwinked by a dodgy belief system that demands proselytizing and, for some personal reason, you feel the need exercise power over others who are inferior in education and resources.

I'm not going to change you, of course, but maybe, just maybe, if enough people like me attempt to expose your nefarious activities then it will result in a groundswell of resistance. It's a battle zone for souls after all, right? That's the only reason you're here...

Finally. The 1st and only honest and revealing post from Stroppy. Thanks you for that. The rest of your posting was pure obfuscation and "house of mirrors" technique.

Without a doubt, Stroppy and his crew, teach, organize, build, etc. but...it is solely a way to get close to people for conversion. As Stroppy finally revealed - it is the 1st, the very 1st requirement of all members of his cult - spread the message and convert. This is clearly stated and how does mere "helping" people compare with the saving of their soul? Not at all...obviously...

Stroppy, deep in his faith-blinded rationalization, sincerely feels that he isn't lying...but he is. What is more important to him - teaching a class or converting a person to his cult? He will use whatever techniques to accomplish conversions. All other activities of church members pale in urgency and he will tell you that if pressed for the truth. Right, Stroppy?

Read again, Mate...(StroppyChops) is completely defined by his beliefs...24/7...

No wonder you're so reluctant to be upfront here about being a missionary...part of the seduction technique, huh? "I'm a professor at a local school here". & "I'm just a regular bloke at the local"...right...not...

C'mon - Stroppy, you were actually honest in one post - please do it again!

What is more important to you - a saved soul for your cult? Or a series of lectures delivered to eager students? Now now - no twisting or deflecting of the direct and clear question...

Stroppy will stand a free beer if you let him tell you the benefits of joining his cult...

C'mon...please...(StroppyChops) is extraordinarily smug and patronizing...he thinks that all the forum members are dunces...he's wrong....he's a huskster...with a not-so-hidden agenda...

-- dagenham thinking he is winning a competitive battle rather than participating in a discussion

Firstly, thanks for the thoughtful replies.

Clever and articulate parry there...

Yet another important topic you completely skirt...wonder why that is?

Now there (missionaries bring misery) is a undeniably true statement for you! Of course, you won't address that well-documented factoid.

A troll I'm not. An inquiring mind of an Agnostic I am.

-- dagenham's response when he has no response

It's impossible for intellect, rationality or scientific proof to even marginally effect a believer's faith. Period. Double Period. Convincing you of anything is entirely futile as "faith" will always be your trump card.

No real discussion there I'm afraid.

Now now...the real chestnut is the faith card being played. Really. Has any true believer been swayed by someone who doesn't share their belief?

Agreed. There are no actual "facts" to discuss.

Better a fool than a victimizer I say.

You lifted that phrase, "stay calm", from UK tourist propaganda, right?

"Originally, I was surprised that the Boston Church of Christ--infamous for its aggressive and manipulative brand of proselytizing--was still actively searching for converts on campus."

-- dagenham just blatantly misquoting stuff to suit his 'arguments'

Apparently the entire bible is open to personal interpretation...Hmmm... and to get drunk excessively (apparently a sin) is the same degree as murdering 12 people and eating them.

So anyone can go North when Jesus returns if they're a good person who has lived a righteous life? In your own customized version of Christianity is there even a 2nd coming/day of reckoning or is that an option you can choose? I don't understand what you're getting at...your particular Christian sect seems to have heavily edited the bible that I'm familiar with

So, the entire born-again Christian cult is bogus? Is that what you are asserting? There is no Judgement Day? No 2nd Coming? No accepting JC as the sole savior, son of God? There is no Satan? No threat of going to Hell? Really? Are we talking about some white-washed sanitized eco-green left-wing version of Christianity here? You're sprouting nonsense by denying these even exist in the bible...hmmm...

Although as we both well know a Christian aint a Christian aint a Christian. And you, apparently have cobbled together your own version - leaving out all the dramatic juicy bits - like hell damnation, etc.

Brother, it's not supposed to come from you - it's coming from your bible. You fail to address any of the valid points I raised as if they don't exist in the "good book". Deflection? You are the one deflecting and not admitting that Christianity has some very nasty threats embedded in its scriptures.

Stroppy, a nice fella I'm sure, won't even admit key aspects of the bible that are fiercely negative toward any non-believers (i.e. roasting in hell). I think that he has home-brewed some "nice and furry" version of Christianity for his own consumption and that is why he refuses to discuss damnation, purgatory, the 2nd coming, Satan, etc.

If you read (StroppyChops') posts he never addresses any of the points I raised and when I provided irrefutable proof of his own inquiries there, of course, no comment from him (i.e. a bible passage threatening unequivocally damnation/hell for all non-believers, my own description of my stance as an agnostic which was the exact sane as Merriam's dictionary).

"to go out into the whole world and preach His gospel" and you (StroppyChops) are freed from this major requirement? You're lying here. No true Christian is excused from this allotted core task. Ever. At any time and you know it. This "strategy" of declaring no intent of overt conversion is an old and tired trick - it has been exposed innumerable times.

The following post is just one example of this wholesale Christian deception/fraud: (pasting his own post from 440 as a third party report)

Very unfortunately for the "infamous" Church of Christ, the Internet exposes all...let's not try, yet again, to deflect addressing your own specific cult...

and now you are ascertaining that, in fact, you don't need to believe in JC/God/Holy Ghost as the sole representation of the saviour in order to gain entrance into heaven and everlasting life?

G-mack, shame on you! (StroppyChops is) lying - he's already written that his 1st & foremost duty in his life is to spread the word and convert non-believers. So he then lies outright and says that he won't make any "Christian overtures"...doing his job most days of the week...

-- dagenham on other religions and faith in general

Islam? Well, no, I didn't include Islam because it is an entirely different animal from Judaism and Buddhism (who both do not arrogantly proselytize and cruelly desecrate native cultural practices out of the misguided goodness of their heartfelt "faith" - "faith" - that problematic word again - the self-righteous maniacal engine for all destructive religious actions)...it's intolerance and hunger for world domination make Islam every bit as sinister as Christianity

One can "understand" but simply not believe. I think that I understand the basic principles of fascism, but I don't believe in them. I want to understand all belief systems and have studied most in detail and at length.

The Jews and Buddhists and Animists? They don't want anyone else necessarily to join their program and don't hurl violent threats at the non-believers around them...plus you have to work hard just to be accepted into their gangs.

I was only equating Islam with Christianity in regards to their shared blatantly-stated hunger and goal for world domination (through ceaseless highly destructive proselytizing). Of course, they're both faith-based as all religions are - "faith" is a red herring issue. Otherwise they are fundamentally different in myriad ways and I would have much more critical views about the practices of Islam (even in it's so-called vanilla version - not the draconian Sharia law) than Christianity in general.

Jews don't have missionaries, nor do Buddhists.

Big difference (in Jewish scriptures) compared to Christianity. Big, very big.

They have Buddhism here - have you noticed are is that just the work of the devil? False prophets and all that,eh? Buddha? He be da devil to a 'faithful" Christian.

Let's run the Mormons off the roads together - or, at the very least, spit on them as they ride by... But why do they only target the middle classes? Because they can tithe handsomely the 10% required to get to the fluffy clouds and Mormons are all about $$. Just look at their temples fro proof positive of that! They should also be wiped out (not as in killed but prevented from doing any "missionary work" in 3rd world countries).

Digging far enough back in history results in no "indigenous" anything at all anywhere. It's all borrowed/imposed/influenced by other competing/adjacent cultures.

Empty ridiculous red herring if there ever was one. The Middle East? History? Blah Blah Blah...

Now is now and Buddhism has been the dominate religion for some time. And, again, any missionaries representing any faith is the core issue here. Now and here in Cambodia.

Any religion that is centered on fear-mongering and violent threats is inherently insecure (obviously) - witness both Judaism and Buddhism which are absent of that feature. If you don't believe then you simply don't get the numerous benefits that those 2 religions offer. They don't threaten non-believers with some Lucifer character roasting you like a pig over a spit.

-- dagenham on stuff that probably makes sense to him, or stuff that didn't fit elsewhere

Society (throughout recorded history) and the Bible seem to be greatly out of synch there indeed re: drunkenness and cannibalism...and why exactly is that again?

That comparison was just a specific example for illustrating the irrelevance of the statement that "there are no degrees of sin" in the bible as applied to accepted norms and values of modern society - where there are most decidedly different degrees of "sinning".

flying chicken wrote:Denegahm must of got raped by one of the Popes in his youth, hence the hatred.

dagenham wrote:

StroppyChops wrote:

Joker Poker wrote:Didn't Jesus say that was how it would be?

I hate to see people devour Christians in this country whilst ignoring all the scamming monks here as though orange robes were some kind of righteousness. There is big money in running wats.

This. Many times over.

And the fools that think Buddhism is indigenous to Cambodia. "Don't bring Christianity here, this country has ALWAYS been Buddhist, you, you... (lost for any relevant way to insult do-gooders) ... child molester scum!"

Digging far enough back in history results in no "indigenous" anything at all anywhere. It's all borrowed/imposed/influenced by other competing/adjacent cultures.

Empty ridiculous red herring if there ever was one. The Middle East? History? Blah Blah Blah...

Now is now and Buddhism has been the dominate religion for some time. And, again, any missionaries representing any faith is the core issue here. Now and here in Cambodia.

And Stroppy (and his cohort/defenders who are all Christians of course) are actively working to "save souls" through any means possible. Why? Because it is the most urgent and highest value goal as outlined repeatedly in the bible. Convert! Convert! Convert!

All the rest is smoke screen deflecting denial...never trust what any missionary "says" becasue their singular goal will trump all other concerns. Period.