British Nick Laycock Arrested For Rape of Tourist in Kampot
- takeoman
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Re: British Nick Laycock Arrested For Rape of Tourist in Kam
Cam Nivag wrote:joleyt wrote:The police are doing the best they can with the evidence provided.
The courts will do all they can to have a correct and just outcome.
Yesterday you said it was a "clear case of Police corruption in Cambodia as the girls were forced into signing false statements against Nick."
Now the police are doing the best they can with evidence provided? It's hard to believe that both of these statements could be true.
Out of curiosity, did you ask the guy before hiring him whether he had a violent criminal record, and does your guesthouse have any policies about your bartenders getting female guests drunks and having sex with them on the premises?
I think that, having sobered up, he has realised it is not the best idea, if you want to continue doing business in Kampot,to publically accuse the local constabulary of corruption.
Last edited by takeoman on Mon Aug 24, 2015 12:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: British Nick Laycock Arrested For Rape of Tourist in Kam
You must be new. The only thing that helps is money. Next time don't call the authorities.joleyt wrote:The police are doing the best they can with the evidence provided.
The courts will do all they can to have a correct and just outcome.
- General Mackevili
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Re: British Nick Laycock Arrested For Rape of Tourist in Kam
That. He's done a 180° turn on his first statement.takeoman wrote:Cam Nivag wrote:joleyt wrote:The police are doing the best they can with the evidence provided.
The courts will do all they can to have a correct and just outcome.
Yesterday you said it was a "clear case of Police corruption in Cambodia as the girls were forced into signing false statements against Nick."
Now the police are doing the best they can with evidence provided? It's hard to believe that both of these statements could be true.
Out of curiosity, did you ask the guy before hiring him whether he had a violent criminal record, and does your guesthouse have any policies about your bartenders getting female guests drunks and having sex with them on the premises?
I think that, having sobered up, he has realised it is not the best idea, if you want to continue doing business in Kampot,to publically accuse the local constabulary of corruption.
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- vladimir
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Re: British Nick Laycock Arrested For Rape of Tourist in Kam
My personal opinion is that the girl was raped and later talked out of going through with the complaint. I have that opinion largely because of a gut feeling (and I have a big gut), but also because of the heavy censorship on the facebook page when gavinmac raised perfectly reasonable questions and made logical observations. I think they even banned him and wiped his posts, and criticised other posters for daring to suspect their friend. Yet they posted the news.Cam Nivag wrote:Yes, I agree, there are a few things that trouble me about the response by Joel Miles, the owner of Arcadia Backpackers. First, his exaggerated language defending his employee and his business at all costs. Only two people really know if this lady consented to sex, her and Laycock. Assuming either one of them remembers. Miles can't know whether his guest consented to sex with his employee. Yet he posts that this is a "clear" case of police corruption, that his employee is "innocent," and that his CCTV footage is somehow "conclusive" that the woman wasn't raped.
Second, there's no expression of remorse here, like "we're sorry this happened," "the safety of our guests is our highest priority," or "we're re-evaluating our policies about hiring guys with violent criminal records and then letting them get our female guests drunk and have sex with them when the girls are too drunk to remember if they consented, so that this sort of thing doesn't happen again."
Instead the gist of his response is she's a liar, she consented to sex with Laycock, the evidence of her consent is somehow "conclusive," Laycock's a wonderful "stand up guy," and the police are corrupt. Absolutely nothing is in dispute and nothing is the fault of Arcadia or its employee Laycock, if you believe Miles.
Yes, he could get shitfaced on duty, leave his post, have sex near the water on our time, but hey, he's way too good a guy to lie.
To slate the cops for being corrupt, whilst simultaneously censoring valid questions and observations would be a joke if it were not for the seriousness of the situation.
If they do a 180 degree turn on 'corrupt cops' could they not also do a 180-degree turn on what happened?
The guesthouse is now going to be saddled with the reputation of an institution which rushed to defend a rapist by some, rightly or wrongly. Nice, maybe tripadvisor will add points for that.
Only a matter of time before some Khmer reads the news and chats with the cops about thestupid facebook entry, so enjoy your freedom/guesthouse while it lasts.
I feel sorry for the next girl that gets raped, she will automatically be doubted because of this idiocy.
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Re: British Nick Laycock Arrested For Rape of Tourist in Kam
I think Kampot is a small expat community and there's a sentiment among some there that nothing should be discussed on the Kampot FB page that might negatively affect the reputation of Kampot or any expat-owned business there.
I started a discussion on the FB page about the incident, and then some people complained (unreasonably in my mind) that the discussion of arrests before someone was convicted was inappropriate and inconsistent with Western values and journalistic standards. Then someone complained that the incident might unfairly harm Arcadia's reputation, because in their minds, the incident likely had nothing to do with Arcadia. I think reasonable, objective people would disagree with the notion that the incident had nothing to do with the guesthouse.
I wasn't out to lynch Laycock, I pointed out that he had no marks on him consistent with a struggle, and if she was drunk and couldn't remember much, then she's not a reliable witness.
Anyway, vladimir is right, the FB page admins deleted the entire thread, banned me from the group, then promptly allowed the Arcadia owner to start a new thread on the same topic setting out Arcadia's position, then when people questioned some facts there someone deleted that thread as well.
However, I don't think that the heavy-handed and biased moderating of the Kampot Noticeboard Facebook group sheds any light on whether this girl was raped. Nor do I think the self-serving and defensive comments by the Arcadia owner-- about Laycock being a saint and the police being corrupt-- shed any light on whether she was raped.
The woman drunkenly went into an Arcadia room with an Arcadia bartender, they had sex, and either she didn't consent or she was too drunk too remember consenting. There's no suggestion from Arcadia or anyone else that this girl "made up" being raped for some nefarious purpose, like in a scheme to set Laycock up. Either she was raped or Laycock got her so drunk before sex that she was confused and "mistaken" as to whether she was raped when she made the initial complaint. Neither of those scenarios speaks well for Laycock or for how Arcadia runs its backpackers hostel.
Maybe Jack Laurenson will have more information for us, but at this point I don't think I or the Arcadia owner or anyone else (except Laycock and the alleged victim) can really opine on whether she consented to sex.
I started a discussion on the FB page about the incident, and then some people complained (unreasonably in my mind) that the discussion of arrests before someone was convicted was inappropriate and inconsistent with Western values and journalistic standards. Then someone complained that the incident might unfairly harm Arcadia's reputation, because in their minds, the incident likely had nothing to do with Arcadia. I think reasonable, objective people would disagree with the notion that the incident had nothing to do with the guesthouse.
I wasn't out to lynch Laycock, I pointed out that he had no marks on him consistent with a struggle, and if she was drunk and couldn't remember much, then she's not a reliable witness.
Anyway, vladimir is right, the FB page admins deleted the entire thread, banned me from the group, then promptly allowed the Arcadia owner to start a new thread on the same topic setting out Arcadia's position, then when people questioned some facts there someone deleted that thread as well.
However, I don't think that the heavy-handed and biased moderating of the Kampot Noticeboard Facebook group sheds any light on whether this girl was raped. Nor do I think the self-serving and defensive comments by the Arcadia owner-- about Laycock being a saint and the police being corrupt-- shed any light on whether she was raped.
The woman drunkenly went into an Arcadia room with an Arcadia bartender, they had sex, and either she didn't consent or she was too drunk too remember consenting. There's no suggestion from Arcadia or anyone else that this girl "made up" being raped for some nefarious purpose, like in a scheme to set Laycock up. Either she was raped or Laycock got her so drunk before sex that she was confused and "mistaken" as to whether she was raped when she made the initial complaint. Neither of those scenarios speaks well for Laycock or for how Arcadia runs its backpackers hostel.
Maybe Jack Laurenson will have more information for us, but at this point I don't think I or the Arcadia owner or anyone else (except Laycock and the alleged victim) can really opine on whether she consented to sex.
- Jamie_Lambo
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Re: British Nick Laycock Arrested For Rape of Tourist in Kam
if, going off opinions from an older rape discussion, if she was obviously wasted, she would have been too drunk to consent, in that case would it not still be rape?
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Re: British Nick Laycock Arrested For Rape of Tourist in Kam
I don't think Cambodia'a laws or judiciary are advanced enough to deem that sex with a woman too drunk to consent is rape.Jamie_Lambo wrote:if, going off opinions from an older rape discussion, if she was obviously wasted, she would have been too drunk to consent, in that case would it not still be rape?
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Re: British Nick Laycock Arrested For Rape of Tourist in Kam
Jamie_Lambo wrote:if, going off opinions from an older rape discussion, if she was obviously wasted, she would have been too drunk to consent, in that case would it not still be rape?
Legally seen YES. But it's always a bit tricky...... she gets that drunk that she isn't able to grunt "yes" or "no" anymore and later she claims that she had been raped. What is if he also was fuckin' drunk ?
How many times in your life did it happen that you woke up in the morning, looked next to you, and thought "oooops - what a surprise. I've never seen that chick" ?
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Re: British Nick Laycock Arrested For Rape of Tourist in Kam
the other discussion was of the 2 khmer boys that allegedly raped a backpacker, who was highly intoxicated, in the end i dont think we came to a final verdict as it was a clash of opinions
me, its highly likely that the vast majority of times i have sex with a new conquest that theres a good chance im intoxicated, and more often than not so is the other party, is this rape, no, if they were unconscious or close to it then yes, drunk, then no, if they were drunk and consented then after regretted it and think they would never have done it sober, is this rape, no, its her own fault for getting that drunk, theres a difference between rape and regret, even if youve been so drunk that you cant remember if you had sex or not***, thats not rape, someone forcing someone to have sex is rape, no ones forcing you to drink yourself into a state where you dont know what youre doing (unless spiked drinks are involved then thats different)
***[edit] im talking about if 2 people are out drinking together or met in a club or something, not some guy going round hunting down drunk women on their way home from a night out, as it sounds depending how you read it lol just thought id point that out
me, its highly likely that the vast majority of times i have sex with a new conquest that theres a good chance im intoxicated, and more often than not so is the other party, is this rape, no, if they were unconscious or close to it then yes, drunk, then no, if they were drunk and consented then after regretted it and think they would never have done it sober, is this rape, no, its her own fault for getting that drunk, theres a difference between rape and regret, even if youve been so drunk that you cant remember if you had sex or not***, thats not rape, someone forcing someone to have sex is rape, no ones forcing you to drink yourself into a state where you dont know what youre doing (unless spiked drinks are involved then thats different)
***[edit] im talking about if 2 people are out drinking together or met in a club or something, not some guy going round hunting down drunk women on their way home from a night out, as it sounds depending how you read it lol just thought id point that out
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Punchy McShortstacks School of Hard Knocks
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