Do you speak broken English?

mannanman · Post by **mannanman** » Mon Jul 19, 2021 12:02 pm

lagrange wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 8:47 am Language has a simple purpose: to communicate with other humans. So whatever works. I tried to teach the gf something. She said, "why you look me?" I said , no, you have to use the small words as well "why DO you look AT me", she couldnt work out why I wanted to make life so complex, so she ignored me. Rightly so, when I thought about it, I mean, I got the message the first time, so why f**k around with it?

Because you don’t want people to think she’s a bar girl?

Bitte_Kein_Lexus · Post by **Bitte_Kein_Lexus** » Mon Jul 19, 2021 1:28 pm

Ghostwriter wrote: ↑Sat Jul 17, 2021 9:40 pm
Bitte_Kein_Lexus wrote: ↑Sat Jul 17, 2021 3:18 pm Is English you're native language?
Der teufel steckt im details, so i've been told....

Can I blame it on my auto-correct?

Pseudonomdeplume wrote: ↑Sun Jul 18, 2021 9:45 pm Disagree!
Leave out the unnecessary past tense and passe compose if you want to ensure they understand you easier, because they jumbles into words and they often won't tell you they didn't understand what you said, pick up a few words here and there and design their own construction of your narrative. This can be particularly harmful if they miss a not or didn't. "Me go cinema" is sorted (assuming they know cinema). "I went to the cinema" "You go?" "No, I went" "When?" "I've been to the cinema" "You eat already?"
Think about when you are learning Khmer. You only know a few words and if other needless ones are incorporated, they have finished talking while you are still back at word 3. Learning Tarzan English saves a lot of time and confusion. For past tense, you simply add "already". Class dismissed. Class dismiss already. "Bye bye" works.

You're basically teaching them everything wrong at the same time.
1-Wrong pronunciation (dropping an -ed sound, one of my pet peeves)
2-Wrong grammar
3-Wrong vocabulary

I'm guessing you're French? Would someone teach French as "Je aller, tu aller, il aller..."? Of course not. Or in my case: "Ich will/wollen, du will/wollen, er will..."? It's simply not the correct way to speak with someone, and falling into such a habit with someone learning the language only does them a disservice by reinforcing bad habits. Once those bad habits are set, they're really hard to change. Like that "already" habit which you recommend, which many Khmers use because they were improperly taught and now it's fossilized...

The worst are those guys who speak pidgin English, and then use completely ridiculous vocabulary within it (or have a strong regional accent and speak really fast):
"Me go Yorkshire. Me fly plane England. When me land, me go see mum, because her cancer metastasized and her dementia no good now"

In the short-term I guess sure, it helps you understand each other, but it's an awful habit to use linguistically-speaking and doesn't help them improve. Just grade your language a bit instead, slow down your speaking and enunciate words/sentences.

Doc67 · Post by **Doc67** » Mon Jul 19, 2021 2:18 pm

Freightdog wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 12:43 am
Pseudonomdeplume wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 12:12 am For half the people on here, English is obviously not their first language, 80% can't spoke proper anyways, half are morons and the rest are oxy-moronic
There’s a certain irony in some of what you write, and I can only presume it’s for comic effect.

Interesting math.

mannanman · Post by **mannanman** » Mon Jul 19, 2021 2:52 pm

Maths.

Grand Barong · Post by **Grand Barong** » Mon Jul 19, 2021 7:37 pm

mannanman wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 2:52 pmMaths.

Doesn't really matter, Math was actually an earlier abbreviation than Maths.

mannanman · Post by **mannanman** » Mon Jul 19, 2021 7:55 pm

Grand Barong wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 7:37 pm
mannanman wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 2:52 pmMaths.
Doesn't really matter, Math was actually an earlier abbreviation than Maths.

But it does matter. It’s the Internet.

(Shouldn’t really start a sentence with but, but it doesn’t really matter. But)

Post by **Freightdog** » Mon Jul 19, 2021 8:19 pm

mannanman wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 12:02 pm
lagrange wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 8:47 am Language has a simple purpose: to communicate with other humans. So whatever works. I tried to teach the gf something. She said, "why you look me?" I said , no, you have to use the small words as well "why DO you look AT me", she couldnt work out why I wanted to make life so complex, so she ignored me. Rightly so, when I thought about it, I mean, I got the message the first time, so why f**k around with it?
Because you don’t want people to think she’s a bar girl?

Actually, far more than that.

Why you look me

Why do you look for me?
Why do you look at me?
Why do you look to me?

Assuming that this girl is only ever going to speak to you, then it might be a simple convenience to let her dictate that english be spoken as a literal translation of what she understands that she wants to say.
In the above very simple example, 3 little unimportant words make a very significant difference to the initial phrase. Assuming that she isn’t restricted on who she’s allowed to talk to in English, then she can no longer rely on the connection that you have to be able to comprehend each other beyond simple words. At the point that the less familiar recipient doesn’t understand her truncated form of speaking, the conversation is going to go on twice as long as it ought to, or the meaning of what she’s saying may be completely misunderstood.

An often forgotten point of communication is ensuring that the other person (on the receiving end) actually understands the message. You’d be surprised at the intelligence of some people who fail at this very important task.
An engineer explaining to another engineer a concept that is fundamental to his design is likely to get the idea across. But unless his target customer is another engineer, then he might fail completely.

It’s important to make allowances for people fresh to a language, (certainly as someone trying to get his head around Khmer I would like that to happen), but it’s also important that bad habits are corrected before they become too well lodged.

mannanman · Post by **mannanman** » Mon Jul 19, 2021 8:45 pm

Yes they’re all good points, however, native English speakers often do exactly what you’re conveying, often it’s a dialect variation from a country or county especially in the UK.

Or they’re just thick.

Alex · Post by **Alex** » Mon Jul 19, 2021 9:52 pm

I've found that speaking slowly and clearly as well as avoiding to use advanced vocabulary usually works just fine. There's no need to take dumbing it down to an extreme level (Pidgin English / bar girl English).

Pseudonomdeplume · Post by **Pseudonomdeplume** » Mon Jul 19, 2021 10:09 pm

I comes home early, to teach me lovely English, from watching footy down pub with me mates, I likes me footy, me, and done seen the missus with me wallet, innit. I opens me mouth to speak like, and she straight up says "I not stolen nothing, I aint done nothing wrong, I aint never told no lies to noone, neither!" I says to her, I says "What, none no how?" I was so chuffed of her honesty and proper English talk, I lets her off, innit.
I have seen some of their English homework, and it can be advanced with concrete, countable nouns, intransitive possessive, verbs, not to be confused with possessive adjectives, which are actually pronouns, utilised before a noun, as opposed to our old favourite quantitative adjective.
Short sentences are more effective than long. Jesus wept consists of a proper noun and verb.
So what?
Language is for communication. If a message has been conveyed, it has done its job. There are no rules, only guidelines. You wont get arrested or even fined on-spot for a grammatical err. I would question whether any local folks are planning to write their autobiography in English, anytime soon (although, many would make interesting reading).

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