John Bingham wrote:It's no huge secret that the British army trained ANS and KPLNF forces in the 1980s. However I'd take that New Statesman story with a pinch of salt. It ended up in a court case that Pilger lost:

A court heard that Geidt and another former army officer, Anthony de Normann, had wrongly been accused by Pilger's documentary of being SAS officers who trained the Khmer Rouge to lay mines.

Pilger, who had claimed he never intended to make any such allegation, gave an unqualified retraction and apology in court in settlement of the case which was reported to have cost Central TV £350,000 in libel damages and costs.

The 1991 libel case came after Geidt and De Normann travelled to Cambodia in 1989 and joined an international party observing the withdrawal of Vietnamese troops from the conflict-ridden state. In a debate on Cambodia in the Commons in 1990, the Labour MP Ann Clwyd said in the House of Commons that she was on the same mission and met the men but was not convinced by their explanation that they were on holiday.

It sounds more like they were spies than conducting any military training.

http://www.theguardian.com/media/2013/m ... ss-charter

The senior royal official tasked with handling a royal charter to regulate the press is a former military intelligence officer who successfully sued an investigative journalist who had sought to question his presence in Cambodia in the 1980s.

Sir Christopher Geidt, who is the Queen's private secretary, won a high-court libel action against John Pilger and Central Television in 1991. Uncertainty around Geidt's role in Cambodia sparked a debate at the time in parliament that included questions over his possible links to MI6 or the British military.

During the course of the three-day trial, which ended in settlement, the government issued a gagging order citing national security that prevented three ministers and two former heads of the SAS from giving evidence about alleged SAS involvement in Cambodia.

General Mackevili wrote:Hi Gav, and welcome to the forum.

Here is a link you might find informative.

It's a Reddit AMA (Ask Me Anything) where someone who says they survived the Khmer Rouge asks any questions people have.

It's from last year, but pretty interesting:



Edit: It's an "I Am A" not an "Ask Me Anything."

[–]VannyV[S] 4 points 11 months ago
First of all, I apologize for responding to your question late. I have been very busy, and can only spend a few hours a day on reddit, but I will try to answer any question concerning my book.
I had just returned from Cambodia a few months ago. You are right about the conditions of the local people who are still living in poverty and lack proper medical help. As you know everything in Cambodia is very expensive, except for hotels, even the food is more expensive than what it would cost here in America. The elite who have connections within the government get richer every day, while the poor get poorer and poorer. Each time I come back from visiting Cambodia I return with an empty wallet. I donate to all the elders and children that I see wherever I visit. Cambodia is different now than it was in my father's time. The culture and ways of living were completely different then. The best way to help is to voice your opinions to your congressman or senator to pressure the current government to pay more attention to the poor people in the countryside than those who line their pockets.

What do you think about Vietnamese government and what they did in Cambodia ? Do you have any story about Vietnamese soldiers when they fought in Cambodia ? Thank you very much for doing this!!!
permalink
[–]VannyV[S] 3 points 11 months ago
First of all, they came and saved us from the Khmer Rouge. It was good publicity at that time, but afterwards they did not want to leave. Cambodia has a long history full of conflict with its neighbors. After the French left we lost part of the Mekong Delta to Vietnam which had a few million Cambodian's living there. Everybody wanted something from Cambodia, the Vietnamese government used the opportunity to force out the Khmer Rouge in order to further their long held plan to take over Cambodia and Laos as part of Indo-China under their control. Thanks to our hard working former King Sihanouk who pressured the world government to help save Cambodia sanctions were placed on the Vietnamese. The former King knew the threat imposed on Cambodia by his neighboring countries which is why he was so close to China. He knew China gave him the best chance to oust the aggressors.
There are two chapters in my book where I talk about the Vietnamese invasion and occupation in detail, including stories about my encounters with their soldiers.

juansweetpotato wrote:

takeoman wrote:A few more books to ensure you keep your nose to the grindstone.
Chandler:- Facing the Cambodian Past
The Tragedy of Cambodian History
Brother Number One
Cambodia Year Zero
Thion:- Watching Cambodia
Kiernan:- The Pol Pot Regime
How Pol Pot Came To Power
Kiernan&
Boua:- Peasants and Politicians In Kampuchea 1942-1981
Short:- Pol Pot (The History of a Nightmare)
Kamm:- Cambodia
Vickery:- Cambodia A Political Survey
Cambodia 1975-82
Gottesman:- Cambodia After The Khemer Rouge
Etcheson:- The Rise and Demise of Democratic Kampuchea
Jackson ed:- 1975-1978

Happy Reading.

You forgot 'Hu n Se n: Strongman of Cambodia'.

juansweetpotato wrote:
That gagging order was the first time in British history.

Now you know how they kept The Secret Wars a secret. Not really even worth pointing out to people with half a brain who know anything about the case.

You should check out that article on TOF about Colonel Kurtz. That article, amongst other things, accuses the CIA of training Hmong kids aged 10 to be combat soldiers.

Child soldiers? Why not if it helps the fight against the commies (Vietnamese not Chinese) Talk about Asian's not losing face well.

John Bingham wrote:

juansweetpotato wrote:
That gagging order was the first time in British history.

Now you know how they kept The Secret Wars a secret. Not really even worth pointing out to people with half a brain who know anything about the case.

You should check out that article on TOF about Colonel Kurtz. That article, amongst other things, accuses the CIA of training Hmong kids aged 10 to be combat soldiers.

Child soldiers? Why not if it helps the fight against the commies (Vietnamese not Chinese) Talk about Asian's not losing face well.

None of that changes the fact that Pilger misquoted the men which he then admitted and apologized for. The misquote is the source of these claims that SAS trained KR.
Whatever Anthony Poshepny did in Laos is an elephant.

It is highly unlikely Pot Pot would have come to power had President Richard Nixon and his national security adviser, Henry Kissinger, not attacked neutral Cambodia. In 1973, B-52s dropped more bombs on Cambodia's heartland than were dropped on Japan during the second world war: equivalent to five Hiroshimas. Files reveal that the CIA was in little doubt of the effect. "[The Khmer Rouge] are using damage caused by B-52 strikes as the main theme of their propaganda," reported the director of operations on May 2, 1973. "This approach has resulted in the successful recruitment of a number of young men [and] has been effective with refugees."

Prior to the bombing, the Khmer Rouge had been a Maoist cult without a popular base. The bombing delivered a catalyst. What Nixon and Kissinger began, Pol Pot completed. Kissinger will not be in the dock in Phnom Penh. He is advising President Obama on geopolitics. Neither will Margaret Thatcher, nor a number of her retired ministers and officials who, in secretly supporting the Khmer Rouge after the Vietnamese had expelled them, contributed directly to the third stage of Cambodia's holocaust.

gavinbrisbane wrote:I don't mean to be rude..

My name is billy, not silly.

No further response to this particular post. Maybe I have misinterpreted it?

Feel free to correct me if I am wrong, no hard feelings - just read the post/s properly.

unless it is my F**K up, maybe I misconstrued it, only human... & half baked at nearly 3am!

Regards

Gav

What do you think about Vietnamese government and what they did in Cambodia ? Do you have any story about Vietnamese soldiers when they fought in Cambodia ? Thank you very much for doing this!!!
permalink
[–]VannyV[S] 3 points 11 months ago
First of all, they came and saved us from the Khmer Rouge. It was good publicity at that time, but afterwards they did not want to leave. Cambodia has a long history full of conflict with its neighbors. After the French left we lost part of the Mekong Delta to Vietnam which had a few million Cambodian's living there. Everybody wanted something from Cambodia, the Vietnamese government used the opportunity to force out the Khmer Rouge in order to further their long held plan to take over Cambodia and Laos as part of Indo-China under their control. Thanks to our hard working former King Sihanouk who pressured the world government to help save Cambodia sanctions were placed on the Vietnamese. The former King knew the threat imposed on Cambodia by his neighboring countries which is why he was so close to China. He knew China gave him the best chance to oust the aggressors.
There are two chapters in my book where I talk about the Vietnamese invasion and occupation in detail, including stories about my encounters with their soldiers.

He's basically saying that it's better to get rid of the Vietnamese than the Khmer Rouge That's pretty extreme nationalism and he's still a royalist even after Sihanouk's self-reverential games.