newkidontheblock wrote: ↑Sat Aug 15, 2020 11:37 pm

daeum_tnaot wrote:He was not a danger to law and order but a legitimate political contender for power in a democratic system.

If you believe anything else you are opposing democracy.

Truly Democratic system in the Kingdom of Wonder?

Cambodia has been ruled by Ironman for decades. He came into power with tanks to crush the opposing party. Anything that threatens this is a danger to law and order.

When people see injustice, they don’t go to their elected government representatives (police, chief, etc.) they appeal directly to Ironman on Facebook.

Please tell me this is what citizens do in a democracy.

Obviously we can all see the reality of the current situation but I don’t agree with Jerry Atrick’s assertion that somehow Kem Sokha deserved it. This way of thinking is getting it backwards.

Not exactly sure if it's a great move.
China being China, has everything readily and cheap.
Coming over to Cambodia, is only to cater to middle-class and the rich... The poor won't get much out from the Chinese...
Why people still go China to do businesses or get goods out from there?
Just like some of the Chinese shops or factories owners said, i'm going back China where things are much easier and more efficient and cheap...
Garment, China has tonnes of them, why would they give a Da.. about Cambodia....

AndyKK wrote: ↑Fri Aug 14, 2020 6:37 pm

Jerry Atrick wrote: ↑Fri Aug 14, 2020 4:40 pm

newkidontheblock wrote: ↑Fri Aug 14, 2020 2:07 pm So? Cambodia should only lose EBA status if it rounds up all the former members of the CRNP and shoots them?

Otherwise, all is good? And behavior should continue to be encouraged?

No, my point was that a genocide/ethnic cleansing in Myanmar is a far greater/graver crime than the jailing of a dissident politician. Yet both countries have the same sanctions against them.

I find it difficult not to regard these sanctions against Cambodia as being punitive in nature and relating to their ever stronger relationship with the Chinese.

Myanmar and it's political genocide/ethnic cleansing is that of an atrocitie, no doubt a violation of human rights.
Your quote Jerry I agree with on the way you are looking at comparison of today's reasoning of EBA suspension. But, in Cambodia 1975-79 was far worse than what Myanmar is doing to the Rohingya. The Khmer at the time had the idea of racial and cultural supremacy, the idea of having to co-exist with 15% minorities was considered an insult to their race, the idea then was to reduce the Cham muslim and Vietnamese minorities to only 1%. Also most Khmers including the royalty, supported the Khmer Rouge, they succeeded in their aim. Today, over 16 million Cambodians, 14 million are Khmers.
the Khmer account for 97.5% of total population. Polpot, easy to blame just one man for the deaths of a quarter of its own population, while Khmer people are still being seen as the victims of Polpot.
Would anyone agree Cambodia has become an even more racist nation?
The country has been develloping very fast in the last couple of years, it is now changing though as some would say that the racial supremacist ideology is still being used for political gains, although the countries Prime Minister from 1985, HE, himself is that of a Chinese Cambodian.

The Burmese conundrum... When comparing Cambodia to Myanmar, you must look at the period of time over which Cambodia failed to abide by the terms agreed upon when the EBA was ratified. The EU first warned the Cambodian government back in 2012. The Rohingya Crisis started in 2015. While the EU (and to some extent the US) was busy pointing fingers at the clown of Asia, Myanmar's leaders were pretending to move towards a democratic ideal and the respect of basic human rights.

I don't know if Cambodia became a more racist nation. I'd like to know more about that. I truly believe that most of the immigration policies recently passed are directly targeting the Cham and ethnic Vietnamese. Though it is true to Cambodia isn't conducting any ethnic cleansing per se, it is for sure looking for some sneaky ways to kick the Cham and the ethnic Vietnamese out of the country.

The Khmer were never the victims of Pol Pot. The Khmer were the victims of the Khmer. It is a self-inflicted genocide that a large portion of the population gladly participated in (and it shows. The majority of the population has some kind of mental illness that stems from the atrocities committed during the war). I am not saying that they indulged in killing their own, but it was a "kill or get killed" type of situation.

The international scene has been trying to set up a Nuremberg-style trial in Cambodia. It didn't work since the very people that are leading Cambodia were Khmer Rouge murderers themselves. That also adds to the anger of the EU. The Kem Sokha thing is the straw that broke the camel's back.

I disagree with one of your statements. Cambodia has barely developed. The tall, empty condos, the luxury cars and the paved roads are just make believe. The little infrastructure of the country is crumbling. Cambodia will be one of the only countries in Asia that will source most of its power from coal for example (coal plants will most likely be a financial burden once they're completed since coal is slowly but surely getting phased out). The only decent things being built here are 100% financed by foreign entities. The health system is in shambles. Education? Cambodia still is a moron factory. The economy is on the verge of collapsing and consumer debt is the highest in all of Asia. The only development Cambodians witnessed was a much easier access to the means of consumption. That's pretty much it.

Sorry for the long post. All in all, the EBA should be completely withdrawn. Cambodia needs to collapse again before it can truly rise. For Cambodia to rise, there must be no UNTAC following the collapse and the conflict that will ensue. Nothing. Cambodians need to grow a pair and get things done on their own. All that nationalism must be based on something after all. Show the world that the Khmer are indeed outstanding. We have yet to see anything impressive coming out of Cambodia.

AndyKK wrote: ↑Fri Aug 14, 2020 6:37 pm

Jerry Atrick wrote: ↑Fri Aug 14, 2020 4:40 pm

newkidontheblock wrote: ↑Fri Aug 14, 2020 2:07 pm So? Cambodia should only lose EBA status if it rounds up all the former members of the CRNP and shoots them?

Otherwise, all is good? And behavior should continue to be encouraged?

No, my point was that a genocide/ethnic cleansing in Myanmar is a far greater/graver crime than the jailing of a dissident politician. Yet both countries have the same sanctions against them.

I find it difficult not to regard these sanctions against Cambodia as being punitive in nature and relating to their ever stronger relationship with the Chinese.

Myanmar and it's political genocide/ethnic cleansing is that of an atrocitie, no doubt a violation of human rights.
Your quote Jerry I agree with on the way you are looking at comparison of today's reasoning of EBA suspension. But, in Cambodia 1975-79 was far worse than what Myanmar is doing to the Rohingya. The Khmer at the time had the idea of racial and cultural supremacy, the idea of having to co-exist with 15% minorities was considered an insult to their race, the idea then was to reduce the Cham muslim and Vietnamese minorities to only 1%. Also most Khmers including the royalty, supported the Khmer Rouge, they succeeded in their aim. Today, over 16 million Cambodians, 14 million are Khmers.
the Khmer account for 97.5% of total population. Polpot, easy to blame just one man for the deaths of a quarter of its own population, while Khmer people are still being seen as the victims of Polpot.
Would anyone agree Cambodia has become an even more racist nation?
The country has been develloping very fast in the last couple of years, it is now changing though as some would say that the racial supremacist ideology is still being used for political gains, although the countries Prime Minister from 1985, HE, himself is that of a Chinese Cambodian.

Show me a Khmer who believes they are racially supreme and I'll show you an supreme idiot.