Administration/Moderation Concerns?

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phuketrichard
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Re: Administration/Moderation Concerns?

Postby phuketrichard » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:07 am

so seems many dont like this BS Karma ( which to me is something that needs be EARNED)
so how many actually like it ?? all it does is cause problems and can be abused...
do a poll mods


I dont like it
JB hates it
AE doesn't like it
I assume SC has no use for it

although i didnt see the point of JC's quoted post above (and 1 being deleted) Is see ZERO reason for a -3 karma

GET RID IF IT
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kiwiincambodia
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Re: Administration/Moderation Concerns?

Postby kiwiincambodia » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:11 am

I primarily use Tapatalk so don't have to worry about the karma crap at all.

I was doing things on the PC the other day and logged in and saw I had it, if I hadn't done that I wouldn't have even known I had any karma.
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Re: Administration/Moderation Concerns?

Postby Username Taken » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:27 am

kiwiincambodia wrote:
Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:11 am
I primarily use Tapatalk so don't have to worry about the karma crap at all.
Except when you give me -3 karma, just for fun. Ha ha ha, you so funny.
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frank lee bent
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Re: Administration/Moderation Concerns?

Postby frank lee bent » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:34 am

we had this feature enabled for some time, then turned it off during an upgrade iirc.
people requested it be turned back on, so it was re enabled.
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Re: Administration/Moderation Concerns?

Postby phuketrichard » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:36 am

I'm going to start giving out -3 to every post i dont like or agree with, after all if I DONT AGREE surely it mus be wrong
people requested it be turned back on, so it was re enabled.
who RUN A poll
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Re: Administration/Moderation Concerns?

Postby Username Taken » Sat Jun 03, 2017 9:49 am

The original Karma function became corrupted a couple of years ago when we had all sorts of server problems. The forum software was upgraded, but there was no compatible Karma plugin for the new forum version.
As the CEO tagline was "How's your Karma", it was felt that we should try to re-instate it somehow. We found a developer who could tweek the software to show the points as Karma points, so it was installed.
End of story.

If you don't like it, ignore it. Pretend it's not there. Who really cares if poster X has 63 Karma or 64 Karma? The world continues to turn.
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Re: Administration/Moderation Concerns?

Postby General Mackevili » Sat Jun 03, 2017 10:29 am

As stated, we added it for people who do want it.

I think everyone should know by now THERE IS NO WAY to create a single feedback system that everyone will like.

Some want a like button. Some want a negative feedback option. Some want to rate the post. Some want to rate the poster. Some want to leave a comment. Some want to just skip the comments. What we currently have covers damn near every scenario, but some will still complain about this or that, no doubt.

It's a "FEATURE." A feature that took UT and I time to sort out, and also cost money. If you like a feature, use it. If you don't like it, don't use it.

The good news is that we have a lot of control over this one, and when it's abused, we can rectify it rather easily.

Mr Bingham mentioned getting a shitload of negative karma over nothing, and I had a look and deleted all of them but one point.

Again, all I'm reading from a few of you are complaints. We had really good feedback over a year ago, and this is the absolute best we can come up with which is what we have a took a very long time to get and was based on that feedback, after many developers told us NO.

So if you see abuse, just let us know an we can sort things out.
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Re: Administration/Moderation Concerns?

Postby AE86 » Sat Jun 03, 2017 11:30 am

Just spent 30 minutes typing a reply and my browser crashed AS I WAS SAVING IT!! :evil: Here's the condensed version of what I wrote.

I just wanted to clarify my stance on the subject of Karma, as there are some good things about it I think can be utilised. I'm a moderator myself (on a different forum), so I understand how it can be trying to pander to everyone on the forum. I think there is a simple solution here though, so here's my take on things and how I think we can solve most of people's concerns.

Main problem is, most users don't use the Karma feature, yet everyone is affected by those that do. This leads to posters like trapper having 10 karma (who is obviously the clueless loudmouth at best) and JB (whose posts I have no problem with) having -6. It's obviously not a fair representation of the situation.


Solutions?

Firstly, I think the whole +1, 2, 3 -1, 2, 3 system should be done away with and a simple +1 -1 system put in place (preferably with both scores displayed and not cumulative).

However, knowing that features are difficult to design and implement (and sometimes expensive), at least raise awareness amongst users, especially new ones on how the system works. Being a member of over 20 forums, I've never seen a system like the one here for rating things, so I suspect a lot of people don't even bother trying to learn it. A specific thread, or even a youtube video (yeah, I know it's difficult to do) would help enormously in getting people on the same page, which I think is the main problem here.
I think most like the idea of a rating system, myself included.

I don't mind helping contributing to the making of such an educational thread (hell, I damn well enough already in mechanics posts), so if we had 10-20 members chip in with feedback and composing the thread, or possibly that youtube video, it would take a load off the mods and we'd get a more informed audience on the same page so we don't end up in these constant "scuffles"


By anyway, let's keep the discussion going as I like the idea of rating system, I think it just hasn't been implemented completely yet.
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Re: Administration/Moderation Concerns?

Postby juansweetpotato » Sat Jun 03, 2017 11:45 am

General Mackevili wrote:
Sat Jun 03, 2017 10:29 am
As stated, we added it for people who do want it.

I think everyone should know by now THERE IS NO WAY to create a single feedback system that everyone will like.

Some want a like button. Some want a negative feedback option. Some want to rate the post. Some want to rate the poster. Some want to leave a comment. Some want to just skip the comments. What we currently have covers damn near every scenario, but some will still complain about this or that, no doubt.

It's a "FEATURE." A feature that took UT and I time to sort out, and also cost money. If you like a feature, use it. If you don't like it, don't use it.

The good news is that we have a lot of control over this one, and when it's abused, we can rectify it rather easily.

Mr Bingham mentioned getting a shitload of negative karma over nothing, and I had a look and deleted all of them but one point.

Again, all I'm reading from a few of you are complaints. We had really good feedback over a year ago, and this is the absolute best we can come up with which is what we have a took a very long time to get and was based on that feedback, after many developers told us NO.

So if you see abuse, just let us know an we can sort things out.
First we should report it, then we shouldn't report it. Bingham seriously trolled yet another of my posts. I gave him - 3 on each of his troll posts. What's wrong with that? I thought I was using the feature exactly as it was supposed to be used?
I have also given positive feedback.
Just because that simpering nancy boy gets some negative feedback, he starts whining like a little kid. Afaic, he can do what he has told so many others to do in the past, and don't forget to let the door hit his ass on the way out.

Are they trying to form a 440 cabal on here too?
All the posters complaining about Trapper and karma are the ones who were the main culprits for banning people on 440.and which is why CEO was invented. EDIT: not AE86.

I actually was hoping that it was a new automised system to kick trolls into their place. It seems not.
If it stops grown men like Bingham crying then you had indeed better give him an ice-cream to shut him up. I personally think he is the major troll and a major reason for lack of new members. Nobody wants to hear the nastiness that eminates frim his mouth a lot of the time. When he isn't doing that, he's being some sort of right wing totalitarian judge. He's been posting the same old maps and links for years. Impressive to new arrivals, but pretty lame to old ones.

Too many personal attacks on posters throwing questions/ ideas out to the forum, too many derailed threads due to nothing but malicious trolling.

Reasonable people don't troll posts they don't like, they just ignore them.

Overall I basically agree with what both FLB and AM said pages ago about feedback and trolling.
Everyone should read the link FLB posted, by OSnews, it's well written by system admin.
Last edited by juansweetpotato on Sat Jun 03, 2017 11:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Administration/Moderation Concerns?

Postby General Mackevili » Sat Jun 03, 2017 11:55 am


AE86 wrote:Just spent 30 minutes typing a reply and my browser crashed AS I WAS SAVING IT!! :evil: Here's the condensed version of what I wrote.

I just wanted to clarify my stance on the subject of Karma, as there are some good things about it I think can be utilised. I'm a moderator myself (on a different forum), so I understand how it can be trying to pander to everyone on the forum. I think there is a simple solution here though, so here's my take on things and how I think we can solve most of people's concerns.

Main problem is, most users don't use the Karma feature, yet everyone is affected by those that do. This leads to posters like trapper having 10 karma (who is obviously the clueless loudmouth at best) and JB (whose posts I have no problem with) having -6. It's obviously not a fair representation of the situation.


Solutions?

Firstly, I think the whole +1, 2, 3 -1, 2, 3 system should be done away with and a simple +1 -1 system put in place (preferably with both scores displayed and not cumulative).

However, knowing that features are difficult to design and implement (and sometimes expensive), at least raise awareness amongst users, especially new ones on how the system works. Being a member of over 20 forums, I've never seen a system like the one here for rating things, so I suspect a lot of people don't even bother trying to learn it. A specific thread, or even a youtube video (yeah, I know it's difficult to do) would help enormously in getting people on the same page, which I think is the main problem here.
I think most like the idea of a rating system, myself included.

I don't mind helping contributing to the making of such an educational thread (hell, I damn well enough already in mechanics posts), so if we had 10-20 members chip in with feedback and composing the thread, or possibly that youtube video, it would take a load off the mods and we'd get a more informed audience on the same page so we don't end up in these constant "scuffles"


By anyway, let's keep the discussion going as I like the idea of rating system, I think it just hasn't been implemented completely yet.
Good stuff, but....

1) It's only been running for about a week, so I'm personally surprised by how many people ARE using it, and we didn't even do a big announcement on it.

2) I have no idea what could be confusing about it. You + or - a post or poster and hit submit, with or without a comment.

3) The ONLY feedback we can even consider is making it so that it's always plus or minus ONE, instead of adding/deleting 2 or 3 karma points. Not even sure if it's possible, but will check.

Honestly, we've spent too much time and money on it already, and I feel investing anymore of either is just wasting our time, as this is truly the best available.

As you said, you have NEVER seen a feedback system like this, and it just goes to show we seriously took a lot of time to find something that would give you as much control as possible instead of just some "like" button that does NOTHING else at all. Hell, even Facebook recently added new features, so we are just ahead of the curve, LoL.

And I would almost bet that no other up-to-date phpBB forum has a feedback system like CEO's, as we really had to find someone special who could throw this together as we wanted.

4) I can't imagine a feedback system which ISN'T vulnerable to manipulation. However, we do have the ability to clean up, just not the ability to prevent messes.
"Life is too important to take seriously."

"Life does not cease to be funny when people die any more than it ceases to be serious when people laugh."

Looking for the best deals on hotels and guesthouses in Cambodia?

Book through Agoda:

Phnom Penh
Siem Reap
Sihanoukville
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Koh Rong


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