Pagoda problems: the decline of Buddhism in Cambodia

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Jamie_Lambo
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Re: Pagoda problems: the decline of Buddhism in Cambodia

Post by Jamie_Lambo »

John Bingham wrote:Yeah, what an inspiration for all the young first-time fathers around the world..... :facepalm:
Jamie Lambo wrote:all the "gods/Deities" that you find in buddhism have been adopted from hinduism,
but i see your point, as there is so much crossover
There's even more of a crossover when it comes to beliefs in ancient tree-spirits, water-spirits, the ghost that inhabits the base of Buddha statues etc. Pchum Ben is a good example, as far as I know it doesn't exist outside the kingdom and has no basis in any Buddhist canons.
If you've spent a bit of time around you'll notice these little shrines in odd spots. These are made of banana leaves, rice, flowers, fruit and other stuff, every part has a symbolism. I'll try and dig out the resource I had on this, but I've seen these around in all sorts of spots for years. They are not Buddhist, it's an ancient animist belief in spirits, some good, some potentially malevolent. They need to be fed and appeased.
yeah was going to reply to relentless comment about that,
its something that ive tried to take an interest in
as i love all old folklaw stuff

Thailand i know has some similar tree spirits and stuff
Nang Takhian - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nang_Ta-khian
Nang Tani - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nang_Tani
and there are shrines in the woods and temples dedicated to these female tree spirits
where women give offerings of girly things like beautiful thai dresses
Nang Tani is a beautiufl gentle spirit but will curse you if you chop down the banana tree she lives in, she also avenges women mistreated by men
Nang Takhian sings mournful songs to attract wandering men. As men go nearer her, she will draw them in a fond embrace and squeeze the life out of them
also been a thai horror movie i know based on the Nang Mai "lady of the wood" legends


i know Japanese has some animal spirits like the "Kitsune" from old Japanese folk law - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kitsune#Portrayal
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Re: Pagoda problems: the decline of Buddhism in Cambodia

Post by thelost »

John Bingham wrote: There's even more of a crossover when it comes to beliefs in ancient tree-spirits, water-spirits, the ghost that inhabits the base of Buddha statues etc. Pchum Ben is a good example, as far as I know it doesn't exist outside the kingdom and has no basis in any Buddhist canons.
If you've spent a bit of time around you'll notice these little shrines in odd spots. These are made of banana leaves, rice, flowers, fruit and other stuff, every part has a symbolism. I'll try and dig out the resource I had on this, but I've seen these around in all sorts of spots for years. They are not Buddhist, it's an ancient animist belief in spirits, some good, some potentially malevolent. They need to be fed and appeased.
Cambodia is just like Thailand, with many animist beliefs varying across regions and provinces. It's just countless.

Buddhism is mixed with animist belief called Baramey with some regional differences added in and "hindu" belief called "phrom" from the days of nokor/angkor wat empire.
It's not pure.

Little shrines, they call them Katoom Nek Taa, they're in front of house. Then we have Katoom Mae Pteah, shrine for house guardian spirit inside the house, at the top level of the house on the main pillar.

Then there's Katoom Nek Taa Srok, the main shrine for the whole district of a province. Then there's provincial statue like Taa Domborng Kronhoung in Battambang province, the black giant with a stick.

Then there's belief in nek taa which is spirits, mostly can be spiteful and mischievous and needs to be appeased. then there's arak which are spirits from the forest, lakes, etc and need to ask permission from them before entering their territory to use woods, hunt for animals, etc.
And then there's beysaat which is a form of demon. and there's pret which is demon from hell and they are always starving but cannot eat.
And there's kmouch which is ghosts, either human spirit or animal spirit.
And there's paleurng which is the soul of a person...
I could go on. Now I'm lazy to write them all down.
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Re: Pagoda problems: the decline of Buddhism in Cambodia

Post by John Bingham »

thelost wrote:
Little shrines, they call them Katoom Nek Taa, they're in front of house.
I didn't mean those shrines, I meant the small ones made of plant materials you see near trees, streams etc that are probably more related to Neak Ta.
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Re: Pagoda problems: the decline of Buddhism in Cambodia

Post by thelost »

John Bingham wrote:
thelost wrote:
Little shrines, they call them Katoom Nek Taa, they're in front of house.
I didn't mean those shrines, I meant the small ones made of plant materials you see near trees, streams etc that are probably more related to Neak Ta.
Oh that. They give offerings to the spirits that lives in those areas to appease them, and asking them for permission to enter their territory and use their resources. It's like giving a gift to someone when you go to visit their house.

It's related to Arak and Nek Ta which is interchangable.
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Re: Pagoda problems: the decline of Buddhism in Cambodia

Post by Jamie_Lambo »

thelost wrote:
John Bingham wrote:
thelost wrote:
Little shrines, they call them Katoom Nek Taa, they're in front of house.
I didn't mean those shrines, I meant the small ones made of plant materials you see near trees, streams etc that are probably more related to Neak Ta.
Oh that. They give offerings to the spirits that lives in those areas to appease them, and asking them for permission to enter their territory and use their resources. It's like giving a gift to someone when you go to visit their house.

It's related to Arak and Nek Ta which is interchangable.
yeah there is a load of them shrines here at a Leang Neak Ta Ceremony...
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Re: Pagoda problems: the decline of Buddhism in Cambodia

Post by thelost »

That thing is called ដើមបាយស្រី derm bai srey or បាយស្រី bai srey, it's an offering and usually made of banana parts, flowers and other food offerings.
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Re: Pagoda problems: the decline of Buddhism in Cambodia

Post by Jamie_Lambo »

thelost wrote:That thing is called ដើមបាយស្រី derm bai srey or បាយស្រី bai srey, it's an offering and usually made of banana parts, flowers and other food offerings.
:thumb:
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Re: Pagoda problems: the decline of Buddhism in Cambodia

Post by bolueeleh »

wow, I didnt know that he had wife n child, I shld probably turn in my A2 for buddhist studies at school n burn all the books( not that I still keep any of them) :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :ROFL:
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Re: Pagoda problems: the decline of Buddhism in Cambodia

Post by willyhilly »

I thought that Khmers were animists, not buddhists. The Thai seem to be more genuine buddhists, always praying to the little shrine in the house but are also much more superstitious. There are days when you cannot cut your hair for instance, this is set in stone.
The Thai like to visit fortune tellers much more too.
I remember years ago the Khmer Minister of Education telling me that poor Khmers were stupid enough to give money for a pagoda roof when they didn't have a good roof themselves.
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Re: Pagoda problems: the decline of Buddhism in Cambodia

Post by Samana Johann »

Barang chgout wrote: Fri Feb 03, 2017 9:59 am Can someone explain to me how Buddhism is not a religion?
Dhamma-Vinaya is actually a "religion" bound, but in it's origin such a formal boundage is "just" given for those leaving home under the Buddha. It's not thought as binding for every one and actually has not the intent to get much involved into normal live and sociaty directly, so not meant for general social purposes, and from this view not really that what is religions generally understood. It's a given way to go beyond the world, not directly for it normal purpose. Yet it exist next normal sociaty and has in so far certain impact for those interested and it is not so that it would be that strange that one comes in contact with it via a different realm, like here, via internet, such can also happen if given.

Of course, to mention the OP, it would be more then improper to use given modern technology in the way it is used normally, for gain, enjoyment and sensual pleasure. Such would be very destructive for the doer as well as for the good conviction and faith of many, at least.

A nice introducing approach on this matter is late Upasaka Goenkas speech in this regard.
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