In Cambodian culture, people often communicate much less information than we do in Western countries. They also often tell people what they think they want to hear. This leaves people to guess what they are really thinking, and sometimes they guess wrong, coming to wrong conclusions.

clutchcargo wrote: ↑Thu Apr 04, 2019 10:41 am Anyway, a family member is due to get married in the province next week and he has recently not been answering any calls from the bride to be, his mother and family siblings.

The bride and the family are now threatening to send him to jail and want money compensation. Furthermore, they are threatening to send his mother to jail as well on account she was the one that "arranged" the matchmake.

Then later:

clutchcargo wrote: ↑Thu Apr 11, 2019 9:15 pm Well, it did indeed end up being a storm in a tea cup and I can report the couple got married the other day.

The khmer drama was all about the fact the groom lives in PP and the bride is in the province and there was a miscommunication about when he was expected to go to the province prior to the wedding. The bride's parents had expected him earlier and they feared he had cold feet, they couldn't contact him for some reason, hence got stuck into the groom's mother about it. That got Mrs Cargo and all the sisters worked up and I thought WW3 had started with heated phone conversations and talk of police and jail etc etc

The whole things sounds ridiculous looking back but it was what it was.

You can read more details here: topic27949-10.html

In another situation, a foreign man had a Cambodian wife. Money ran short, so he went back to his home country to earn some more money. I asked her if they had separated. She said she didnt know. While the husband was away, she spent time with other men. When the husband came back, and found out, they did separate.

So if anyone does spend time away from their Cambodian wife or girlfriend, it may be wise to ring regularly, or chat online, so she does not start to imagine things which are not true.

It would be interesting to hear from others who have experienced Cambodians imagining something which is not true.

No one in the west is guilty of this behaviour.

Except flat earthers.... 9/11 truthers... chemtrails.. Russian collusion.... anti-vaxxers..... (feel free to add to the list of the uniquely Cambodian habit of imagining a “truth”.

Expats who thinking that they know everything about Khmers.

This is slightly off topic with respect to your example, but probably on topic enough to post here.

We were warned to manage the expectations of others on us when we first arrived, but didn't heed the warning enough.

This seems to be a problem in most aspects of Khmer thinking, not just relationships, and what we think it comes down to is that a Khmer friend will take a discussion with you about X, and then go and discuss X with their friends/family. The friends/family, being bored and not overly educated, think that X should be X + 1, and over time X + 5 and so on, and then the disenchanted ones will argue that not only do they think X should be X + 5, but let's get aggressive and militant about it, because that's what you said in the first place. You promised X + 5. And they genuinely believe you did.

Example. We initially went into business with our first language tutor. He had his first kid on the way and no reliable income stream, so we suggested buying a second much bigger tuktuk and starting the tours company as an income generator for him. He went home to discuss with his wife, who (as is normal) wears the pants in the house, and by the next day the offer to buy a tuktuk had transformed into us offering to buy a Mercedes bus for their exclusive use. We knocked this back to the idea of a tuktuk, and were greeted with hostility because we promised a Mercedes bus.

By the next day the business plan had grown to several buses and an airconditioned office, with our tutor sitting in a/c comfort all day while directing his minions to do his bidding. We knocked this back to the offer of a tuktuk, and were greeted with hostility because be promised a fleet of Mercedes buses and an air-conditioned office.

On the morrow, the business plan had evolved to - I shit you not - buying a hotel.

This is all true, and obviously an extreme case, but in my experience that's what happens when people with a very limited world view, small resources, and limited education get together and discuss the endless wealth of foreigners.

These days we are very very clear when setting and managing expectations, even to the point of what we would normally consider rude, but it saves a lot of ill-will. Not only do we discuss what is on the table, we discuss what is not on the table, and what we expect others to do as their part of whatever project we're working on. We've carried this into the social enterprise and it makes life in Cambodia just that little bit easier.

StroppyChops wrote: ↑Fri Apr 12, 2019 1:02 pm
These days we are very very clear when setting and managing expectations

So true. You can never do too much managing expectations here. The more you do, the easier and less complicated your life becomes. That equally applies to dealings with barang visitors.

StroppyChops wrote: ↑Fri Apr 12, 2019 1:02 pm This is slightly off topic with respect to your example, but probably on topic enough to post here.

We were warned to manage the expectations of others on us when we first arrived, but didn't heed the warning enough.

...

Also slightly off topic but respect to you Stroppychops, but I can't help but thinking there's a considerable portion of the western millennial population going down that path now. Although I am technically a Gen X'er (I think), I see a concerning amount of entitlement in the rising youth.

Not sure why that came up though, just thought about it when reading your comment.

JerryCan wrote: ↑Sun Apr 14, 2019 7:41 pm

StroppyChops wrote: ↑Fri Apr 12, 2019 1:02 pm This is slightly off topic with respect to your example, but probably on topic enough to post here.

We were warned to manage the expectations of others on us when we first arrived, but didn't heed the warning enough.

...

Also slightly off topic but respect to you Stroppychops, but I can't help but thinking there's a considerable portion of the western millennial population going down that path now. Although I am technically a Gen X'er (I think), I see a concerning amount of entitlement in the rising youth.

Not sure why that came up though, just thought about it when reading your comment.

I think I understand where you're coming from with that, but correct me if I'm wrong. One of the aspects we found endearing of Cambodia was respect for elders - that seems to be fading and being replaced by materialism, and there's an expectation that the materials be given by the elders ... yeah?

StroppyChops wrote: ↑Sun Apr 14, 2019 7:55 pm I think I understand where you're coming from with that, but correct me if I'm wrong. One of the aspects we found endearing of Cambodia was respect for elders - that seems to be fading and being replaced by materialism, and there's an expectation that the materials be given by the elders ... yeah?

I was more thinking of people relying on state handouts in some way or another as unlimited goodies, like how some Cambodians see westerners (a bank vault).

And yes, materialism amongst the youth I think is actually more universal than anything, with the advent of the internet.

explorer wrote: ↑Fri Apr 12, 2019 12:21 pm In Cambodian culture, people often communicate much less information than we do in Western countries. They also often tell people what they think they want to hear. This leaves people to guess what they are really thinking, and sometimes they guess wrong, coming to wrong conclusions.

clutchcargo wrote: ↑Thu Apr 04, 2019 10:41 am Anyway, a family member is due to get married in the province next week and he has recently not been answering any calls from the bride to be, his mother and family siblings.

The bride and the family are now threatening to send him to jail and want money compensation. Furthermore, they are threatening to send his mother to jail as well on account she was the one that "arranged" the matchmake.

Then later:

clutchcargo wrote: ↑Thu Apr 11, 2019 9:15 pm Well, it did indeed end up being a storm in a tea cup and I can report the couple got married the other day.

The khmer drama was all about the fact the groom lives in PP and the bride is in the province and there was a miscommunication about when he was expected to go to the province prior to the wedding. The bride's parents had expected him earlier and they feared he had cold feet, they couldn't contact him for some reason, hence got stuck into the groom's mother about it. That got Mrs Cargo and all the sisters worked up and I thought WW3 had started with heated phone conversations and talk of police and jail etc etc

The whole things sounds ridiculous looking back but it was what it was.

You can read more details here: topic27949-10.html

In another situation, a foreign man had a Cambodian wife. Money ran short, so he went back to his home country to earn some more money. I asked her if they had separated. She said she didnt know. While the husband was away, she spent time with other men. When the husband came back, and found out, they did separate.

So if anyone does spend time away from their Cambodian wife or girlfriend, it may be wise to ring regularly, or chat online, so she does not start to imagine things which are not true.

It would be interesting to hear from others who have experienced Cambodians imagining something which is not true.

It's amazing. Exactly one year after joining this forum (congratulations!) you seem to be the one and only reliable source on (the shortcomings of) Khmer Culture.

Due to changing plans, I was forced to scramble for expensive tickets to Cambodia next month. Her family told me not to bother to visit missus and instead send the money (I would have spent) to them (not missus).

Why? Because one brother needs a new car, one brother in law needs a new car, one brother needs a new moto. Needs = wants. As in wants something shiny and new to impress the young ladies at the drinking place.

Lost in their money equations is that I am married to missus, not them.