I think $3000 per month is a lots. As a local, i spend only $200 per month excluding travelling. i guess the lifestyle of expat and local are way too different. However if you can afford $3000 per month, you will live here so comfortably.

joelightcloud wrote:I have a bike, car, wife and live in a villa and can live comfortably on $4,000 per month. $50,000 per year salary minimum if you don't want to "watch the pennies"

Hello Joe! I see you are even more of a newbie on this forum than I am. Welcome!
Can I ask you a few questions? You have a Khmer wife or western? I ask because if she is Khmer you can own property, maybe a good idea if you are planning to stay long term. How long have you been living here or plan to? Does your 4K include rent?

Some info about me, my wife is Khmer and we do own a one of those townhouses outside of PP. About as much room as a villa, but long and narrow and upright, with one of those garage door fronts. We bought about 5 years ago for 50K, now they go for around 75 or so I think. Not as nice as a villa but is fine for us, more room than we need and I get lots of exercise walking up and down the stairs! When I priced the villas at the time they were going for about 5 or 6 time what we paid for ours, we could not afford that. Thanks again for your comment.

ON the budgeting front I always work out what my minimum budget is for the essentials, food, household bills, petrol, the annual items and see what the comes out at annually. Stick in a contingency % for unforseens and then decide on how much I want to spend on the leisure items. That helps me establish a base minimum if I have to tighten my belt for any reason, the maximum is as high as I want it to be.

To be honest my problem with the prospect of living in Phnom Penh has always been what I see as a lack of available and decent leisure activities. I'd see it as a place to work with not much else to offer leisure wise, since I joined both forums I've hardly ever seen a thread regarding sporting activity. As always it depends on your interests.

joelightcloud wrote:I have a bike, car, wife and live in a villa and can live comfortably on $4,000 per month. $50,000 per year salary minimum if you don't want to "watch the pennies"

chkwoot wrote:$400/mo. bare minimum for me. $200 for rent, $50 for utitilities, $5/day for food (raw, non-processed, bought at supermarket, cooked/prepared by myself at home). I already have kitchen equipment, TV, PC, clothes, etc.

I was recently unable to go out for about 6 weeks and that's what I spent. So I know that this is my barest of minimum... but life gets boring pretty quickly!

The following two answers show how it's all relative to the person. Chkwoot can live off very little, but Joe needs a lot more to be comfortable. I own my own place and spend roughly 600-900$/month. I'd say my average is around 800-850$. I have an excel spreadsheet at home in which I've kept track of my spending meticulously. When I get home I can check the exact yearly average for last year. So far this month I'm at around 575$ or so.

Even when I didn't own my place, I was often able to spend 600$/month including 150$ rent. Now I spend 600
-700$ some months, and 1600$ others. I own two dirt bikes (which can eat up a lot of money at times...) but no car. I travel a lot within Cambodia.

As for sporting activities... you need to look around. There are tons of leagues around. Basketball, ultimate frisbee, hockey, soccer/football, Bogan-rules football, rugby... It's not as obvious as in some cities, but they're all out there, craving for new members.

I'd say as a retired person who wants some comfort, your rent will easily determine your monthly budget. 300-500$ could go to rent alone. Maybe even 1000$ depending on what your expectations are. Next are your eating habits. Assuming you never cook, do you like high-end restaurants or average khmer and western food in a no-frills setting? I still think 3000$ is a lot for a retired guy...

PSD-Kiwi wrote:How long is a piece of string?

The question is not about the length of the string, but rather ask yourself if the string exists.

Samouth wrote:I think $3000 per month is a lots. As a local, i spend only $200 per month excluding travelling. i guess the lifestyle of expat and local are way too different. However if you can afford $3000 per month, you will live here so comfortably.

Hello Samouth, thanks for your input. It is true that the expectations and lifestyle of expats and locals are different. One difference is that the expats that come here necessarily have more spendable assets. They are of the group that can afford the plane ticket to come to Cambodia and setup expenses here. I know many people in the U.S. who find buying the ticket and the stay anywhere prohibitively expensive, because they are stretched as it is with family and kids expenses, housing, car payments, mortgage, taking care of elderly parents, credit card debts, etc. They don't travel, so you never see that group here. The ones that come to stay are either young, with some freedom, working for an NGO or business here, or retired with a pension.

Another reason that locals can live on less is that they have a close network of family and friends. Locals can live with family and support each other. Sharing in the cost of meals, housing and transportation is worth a lot. Having a family support each other is very valuable, even though it may be hard to assign a monetary value, it does have one. Expats don't have this and normally have to pay for everything on their own.

In addition to this, expats pay more. Many times we don't get the same price as locals, speak the language, or know the best places to shop for goods or services. So expats almost always pay more. And we get lonely for what we knew from home, for the food, the entertainment, holidays, activities, etc. These are additional expenses locals don't have. So when expats move to Cambodia, they still want to have some of what they had at home. It is the same with Khmers when they move to the U.S, missing Khmer food, their family and social network that is missing in the U.S. So I guess it is that they have to pay more to get rid of the loneliness. Another factor is that people move away from home because they want some more or new excitement in their life, so they have to pay for that. If not, they would have just stayed home.

StroppyChops wrote:

PSD-Kiwi wrote:How long is a piece of string?

The question is not about the length of the string, but rather ask yourself if the string exists.

It is just a theory!

Health care is often ignored, and again in the postings above, as an expense. The older you get, and worse food you eat, along with dirty habits (sex with complete strangers, booze) the higher the risk of a health issue. I've never heard about the actual costs of health care in PNH, not even mentioning the quality of same. One friend has a policy which does cover him there, but he's the only one. Most I know travel to Bangkok for anything serious, and it isn't cheap here in Thailand at private hospitals. It's cash up front for treatment. None of this pay later or compassion for the patient. You need at least $50,000.usd banked and available to self insure.

^ $1,500-$2,000 as a benchmark for a decent annual health policy I would suggest.

Good point regarding health care. I'd say a good general rule of thumb to follow is this:
"Are you a big spender in California?"
If yes, then you'll spend a lot here as well. If no, then you'll be able to live off relatively little. It all depends on your own frugality and what you consider "fun". I was never much of a big-spender in the west, so I don't spend much here either. What do you like doing in your spare time? Do you play golf everyday? Or do you play solitaire on your kitchen table...? I'm exaggerating a bit, but you the point...