How much should I pay for a language tutor?

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kps
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Re: How much should I pay for a language tutor?

Post by kps »

[ sorry, double post ]
Last edited by kps on Mon Feb 25, 2019 8:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Kammekor
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Re: How much should I pay for a language tutor?

Post by Kammekor »

kps wrote: Mon Feb 25, 2019 7:41 pm
explorer wrote: Mon Feb 25, 2019 7:19 pm I have always recommended that people learn the Khmer alphabet fairly early on. Other people have advised not to in the early stages. People choosing not to learn the Khmer alphabet, should realize that the phonetic writing is not an accurate guide to pronunciation, and should focus on how Cambodians pronounce the words.
I don't know Khmer so I am just asking. Is there really a fail-safe way to go from Khmer script to pronounciation? I.e at least 99% of the words can be read correctly.
Yes, the Khmer alphabet is extremely consequent. The same letter (almost) always sounds the same in the same combination. The main problem for beginners is the alphabet is pretty large and the sound of a vowel can change if you combine it with another consonant.
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Kammekor
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Re: How much should I pay for a language tutor?

Post by Kammekor »

kps wrote: Mon Feb 25, 2019 7:57 pm
Kammekor wrote: Mon Feb 25, 2019 7:52 pm
kps wrote: Mon Feb 25, 2019 7:41 pm
explorer wrote: Mon Feb 25, 2019 7:19 pm I have always recommended that people learn the Khmer alphabet fairly early on. Other people have advised not to in the early stages. People choosing not to learn the Khmer alphabet, should realize that the phonetic writing is not an accurate guide to pronunciation, and should focus on how Cambodians pronounce the words.
I don't know Khmer so I am just asking. Is there really a fail-safe way to go from Khmer script to pronounciation? I.e at least 99% of the words can be read correctly.

My guess is, for example in English it would be impossible. There are no rules to find out how to pronounce "enough", "thought", "island" etc etc

I just tried to learn "garlic" from Google translate. The phonetic came out completely unexpected. But I can't read the Khmer script.

Can anyone read this and get a proper pronounciation?
ខ្ទឹមស
I would say k'tim. The i as in the English word is.
What you say is "close" Google translate phonetic writing
khtoemos

But what the Khmer lady reading says is
doemsaa (oe diphtong)

completely different to my ears
It is, the word k'tim is actually not correct, there's several kinds, and you'd have to ad another word to be more precise. For instance a 'k'tim barang' is an onion, for garlic 'k'tim sor' is common, and that's what she's saying.
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Re: How much should I pay for a language tutor?

Post by kps »

Kammekor wrote: Mon Feb 25, 2019 8:04 pm
kps wrote: Mon Feb 25, 2019 7:57 pm
Kammekor wrote: Mon Feb 25, 2019 7:52 pm
kps wrote: Mon Feb 25, 2019 7:41 pm
explorer wrote: Mon Feb 25, 2019 7:19 pm I have always recommended that people learn the Khmer alphabet fairly early on. Other people have advised not to in the early stages. People choosing not to learn the Khmer alphabet, should realize that the phonetic writing is not an accurate guide to pronunciation, and should focus on how Cambodians pronounce the words.
I don't know Khmer so I am just asking. Is there really a fail-safe way to go from Khmer script to pronounciation? I.e at least 99% of the words can be read correctly.

My guess is, for example in English it would be impossible. There are no rules to find out how to pronounce "enough", "thought", "island" etc etc

I just tried to learn "garlic" from Google translate. The phonetic came out completely unexpected. But I can't read the Khmer script.

Can anyone read this and get a proper pronounciation?
ខ្ទឹមស
I would say k'tim. The i as in the English word is.
What you say is "close" Google translate phonetic writing
khtoemos

But what the Khmer lady reading says is
doemsaa (oe diphtong)

completely different to my ears
It is, the word k'tim is actually not correct, there's several kinds, and you'd have to ad another word to be more precise. For instance a 'k'tim barang' is an onion, for garlic 'k'tim sor' is common, and that's what she's saying.
OK, that explains it.
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Re: How much should I pay for a language tutor?

Post by explorer »

kps wrote: Mon Feb 25, 2019 7:41 pm I just tried to learn "garlic" from Google translate. The phonetic came out completely unexpected. But I can't read the Khmer script.

Can anyone read this and get a proper pronounciation?
ខ្ទឹមស
It is spelt wrong, so you are getting the wrong pronunciation.

It is ខ្ទឹម.

The closest is probably ktum.

Everyone should agree on the k, t and m. Ask a Cambodian to pronounce the sound between the t and m. Different Cambodians may even pronounce it differently.
## I thought I knew all the answers, but they changed all the questions. ##
kps
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Re: How much should I pay for a language tutor?

Post by kps »

explorer wrote: Mon Feb 25, 2019 8:38 pm
kps wrote: Mon Feb 25, 2019 7:41 pm I just tried to learn "garlic" from Google translate. The phonetic came out completely unexpected. But I can't read the Khmer script.

Can anyone read this and get a proper pronounciation?
ខ្ទឹមស
It is spelt wrong, so you are getting the wrong pronunciation.

It is ខ្ទឹម.

The closest is probably ktum.

Everyone should agree on the k, t and m. Ask a Cambodian to pronounce the sound between the t and m. Different Cambodians may even pronounce it differently.
Isn't it ktoem-soo = white ktoem? (oe diphtong)
ខ្ទឹមស
According to a book I have that is the translation of garlic.
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Re: How much should I pay for a language tutor?

Post by explorer »

kps wrote: Mon Feb 25, 2019 8:47 pm Isn't it ktim-soo = white ktim?
ខ្ទឹមស
According to a book I have that is the translation of garlic.
Yes you are right. I wrote this quickly and realized later.

There are two words. ខ្ទឹម is used for garlic and onions. ស means white. When you put them together it means garlic (distinguishes it from onions).

With English letters I would say ktum sor. In Australia we pronounce the r less than Americans. To Americans, the r is hardly pronounced.
## I thought I knew all the answers, but they changed all the questions. ##
explorer
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Re: How much should I pay for a language tutor?

Post by explorer »

kps wrote: Mon Feb 25, 2019 7:41 pm
explorer wrote: Mon Feb 25, 2019 7:19 pm I have always recommended that people learn the Khmer alphabet fairly early on. Other people have advised not to in the early stages. People choosing not to learn the Khmer alphabet, should realize that the phonetic writing is not an accurate guide to pronunciation, and should focus on how Cambodians pronounce the words.
I don't know Khmer so I am just asking. Is there really a fail-safe way to go from Khmer script to pronounciation? I.e at least 99% of the words can be read correctly.

My guess is, for example in English it would be impossible. There are no rules to find out how to pronounce "enough", "thought", "island" etc etc
Khmer is in some ways like English in this respect. You learn the alphabet, and also learn how to pronounce each word. If you tried to read words you dont know, you would pronounce some wrong.

Khmer is difficult for learners because there is no space between words. You wont know where one word ends and the next word starts.
## I thought I knew all the answers, but they changed all the questions. ##
explorer
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Re: How much should I pay for a language tutor?

Post by explorer »

When I suggest people learn the Khmer alphabet, I mean like a child in grade one. You will be able to spell words, and it will result in better pronunciation. You can even use this in combination with phonetic spelling, to help you remember.

Some people may think I am suggesting they should learn to read Khmer fluently. Most people are not going to be able to do that in the first few years. Most people never will.
## I thought I knew all the answers, but they changed all the questions. ##
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Re: How much should I pay for a language tutor?

Post by kps »

explorer wrote: Mon Feb 25, 2019 9:20 pm When I suggest people learn the Khmer alphabet, I mean like a child in grade one. You will be able to spell words, and it will result in better pronunciation. You can even use this in combination with phonetic spelling, to help you remember.

Some people may think I am suggesting they should learn to read Khmer fluently. Most people are not going to be able to do that in the first few years. Most people never will.
That is a good way of putting it. It is a help to know the alphabet. But to start, as a beginner, by making most notes in Khmer script, would be too hard, imho.
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