wackyjacky wrote:

JBTrain wrote:

wackyjacky wrote:. Reading up on it I found out that MSG is maybe the biggest trigger.

Where did you read this ? Far as I know no study has ever linked MSG with the symptoms often attributed to it.

.....You're right there's no definitive scientific proof. I read about 3 or 4 sites and they all mentioned MSG at or near the top of possible migraine triggers though. I read Wiki, Mayo Clinic, & WebMD as well. Just Google migraines. I had never heard of MSG being linked before either. Triggers are all over the place. I bet they listed 50-100. Makes it sound to me like it's psychosomatic. It's all very individual. It reminds me of the Silicone boobs thing. So many symptoms & problems with no actual proof. I remember the stuff 'Accent' that everyone's Mom used in the 70s, then 10 years later it was bad for you all of a sudden & 1/2 the Chinese restaurants had NO MSG signs up everywhere. Like I said before it makes me really tired, but only with a beer. I got the gf off of instant noodles, Red Bull, & caffeine & she only gets a migraine occasionally now compared to every other day.

Perhaps.

” MSG was implicated in Chinese Restaurant Syndrome (CRS) a collection of side effects including headache, chest pain, flushing, numbness, and swelling. However, scientific studies have not shown any direct link between these symptoms and MSG. It's possible that CRS was the result of other food allergies. We tend to share the perspective of food writer Jeffrey Steingarten who wondered if MSG is really so terrible, "Why Doesn't Everyone in China Have a Headache?" We also wonder why some people complain about MSG in Asian food yet have no problems with snack chips or glutamate-containing foods like ketchup. At the same time, this writer's own mother claims to have an MSG sensitivity, and we are loath to doubt her."

I'm a former CRS believer. I now attribute my own symptoms to overeating, sugar, black tea, and stressing out about MSG.

I don't really require scientific proof. The amount of things science can't explain could fill a Universe.

If I try something a few times and it has a certain affect upon me I go with that experience. That is basically science anyways, doing the same thing over again to produce the same result.

If you don't think MSG is good for you or don't like the affect it brings about then don't eat it.

Fuck whatever Science says either way; listen to your body. Everyones' is different.

FreeSocrates! wrote:I don't really require scientific proof. The amount of things science can't explain could fill a Universe.

If I try something a few times and it has a certain affect upon me I go with that experience. That is basically science anyways, doing the same thing over again to produce the same result.

If you don't think MSG is good for you or don't like the affect it brings about then don't eat it.

Fuck whatever Science says either way; listen to your body. Everyones' is different.

Thats why health promotion rarely works

While I wouldnt deride the advice "listen to your body" Im sure many people who take harmful drugs go with the experience. The body says "this is great I want more of this" so its no always wise to go with what your body says. However a more relevant example is the use of Fructrose as a sweetener. It is found in many processed foods and is largely responsible for the "obesity epidemic" It tastes very nice and people like to eat these foods yet it is as toxic as alcohol. The body cant process it and it ends up causing metabolic syndrome and destroying the liver.

^ Are you sure about this (fructose)? I always thought it was a slightly healthier alternative to sugar.

I think I may be a bad parent.

A lot of doctors & nutritionists are trying to get sugar classified as a poison these days.

FreeSocrates! wrote:I don't really require scientific proof. The amount of things science can't explain could fill a Universe.

If I try something a few times and it has a certain affect upon me I go with that experience. That is basically science anyways, doing the same thing over again to produce the same result.

If you don't think MSG is good for you or don't like the affect it brings about then don't eat it.

Fuck whatever Science says either way; listen to your body. Everyones' is different.

How do you know it's the MSG? Same symptoms from a handful of Doritos?

Maybe it could be the MSG...

But my problems have more to do with Caffeine and Alcohol. I go through phases where I'm like totally allergic to these 2 things, and though I love them. I have to sometimes cut them out altogether.

When I tell a doctor they don't believe it's possible to have a fluctuating allergy like this (maybe I have to go to a specialist). But if during one of these phases I drink coffee or alcohol, I develop a very bad response to it. I've had to learn through like 3 years of doing it... and the symptoms aren't pleasant.

But then I can go months with drinking it and be fine.

I'm not saying do away with Science altogether, but Science does not have all the answers... (yet?).

wackyjacky wrote:A lot of doctors & nutritionists are trying to get sugar classified as a poison these days.

I believe anything in large doses is poison.

Even H20 and O2 are toxic in ridiculous quantities (based on science)...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_intoxication

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxygen_toxicity

Tim Linkinwater wrote:^ Are you sure about this (fructose)? I always thought it was a slightly healthier alternative to sugar.

I think I may be a bad parent.

While there is mounting evidence of the adverse effects of fructrose its still somewhat controversial. Not surprisingly the fast food industry is not convinced. Theres plenty of stuff on the subject you can check both for and against, a couple linking fructrose to metabolic syndrome here.

Fructose: A Key Factor in the Development of Metabolic Syndrome and Hypertension
Zeid Khitan, and Dong Hyun Kim Journal of Nutrition and MetabolismVolume 2013 (2013),

1Marshall University’s Joan C. Edwards School of Medicine, 1600 Medical Center Drive, Huntington, WV 25701-3655, USA2Department of Medicine, Marshall University Joan Edwards School of Medicine, 1600 Medical Center Drive, Huntington, WV 25701-3655, USA
Received 7 March 2013; Revised 14 May 2013; Accepted 14 May 2013
Academic Editor: Peter M. Clifton

Copyright © 2013 Zeid Khitan and Dong Hyun Kim. This is an open access article distributed under the Creative Commons Attribution License, which permits unrestricted use, distribution, and reproduction in any medium, provided the original work is properly cited.

Abstract

Diabetes mellitus and the metabolic syndrome are becoming leading causes of death in the world. Identifying the etiology of diabetes is key to prevention. Despite the similarity in their structures, fructose and glucose are metabolized in different ways. Uric acid, a byproduct of uncontrolled fructose metabolism is known risk factor for hypertension. In the liver, fructose bypasses the two highly regulated steps in glycolysis, glucokinase and phosphofructokinase, both of which are inhibited by increasing concentrations of their byproducts. Fructose is metabolized by fructokinase (KHK). KHK has no negative feedback system, and ATP is used for phosphorylation. This results in intracellular phosphate depletion and the rapid generation of uric acid due to activation of AMP deaminase. Uric acid, a byproduct of this reaction, has been linked to endothelial dysfunction, insulin resistance, and hypertension. We present possible mechanisms by which fructose causes insulin resistance and suggest actions based on this association that have therapeutic implications

Dietary fructose and the metabolic syndrome.

Miller A1, Adeli K. Curr Opin Gastroenterol. 2008 Mar;24(2):204-9

Abstract

PURPOSE OF REVIEW:

Fructose, a naturally found sugar in many fruits, is now commonly used as an industrial sweetener and is excessively consumed in Western diets. High fructose intake is increasingly recognized as causative in development of prediabetes and metabolic syndrome. The mechanisms underlying fructose-induced metabolic disturbances are unclear but are beginning to be unravelled. This review presents recent findings in this field and an overall mechanistic insight into the metabolic effects of dietary fructose and its role in metabolic syndrome.

RECENT FINDINGS:

Recent animal studies have confirmed the link between fructose feeding and increased plasma uric acid, a potentially causative factor in metabolic syndrome. Advanced glycation end products are also implicated because of their direct protein modifications and indirect effects on inflammation and oxidative stress. Human studies have demonstrated fructose's ability to change metabolic hormonal response, possibly contributing to decreased satiety.

SUMMARY:

There is much evidence from both animal models and human studies supporting the notion that fructose is a highly lipogenic nutrient that, when consumed in high quantities, contributes to tissue insulin insensitivity, metabolic defects, and the development of a prediabetic state. Recently evidence has helped to decipher the mechanisms involved in these metabolic changes.

No. All wrong. You are ingesting shower water while showering. Even a little bit will get you sick. Take pains not to get the water in your mouth and rinse your mouth out with fresh water when you get out of the shower. You will recover quickly.